Poll: Would you support a parcel tax for Napa schools?

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Saturday, November 07, 2009

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By Register Online Staff

Would you support a parcel tax for Napa schools?(survey software)

133 comment(s)

shareathought wrote on Nov 6, 2009 6:37 PM:

" Before taking the poll, please remind us, in addition to our property taxes, what are the assessments now and what are they for? Aren't half in support of education, and what, is that total amount?
(Some of us have our taxes automatically deducted from our accounts.) "

nappalachia wrote on Nov 7, 2009 5:47 AM:

" If you choose to have children, you should pay for their education. The system we have now is socialism accroding to tea baggers. "

glenroy wrote on Nov 7, 2009 8:02 AM:

" Money has never been the issue….the problem is incompetent management based on time served not accomplishments or skill. "

Orange99 wrote on Nov 7, 2009 8:23 AM:

" I care enough to pay once for yours and we home school. "

naysayer wrote on Nov 7, 2009 8:51 AM:

" shareathought, I have heard this tax will end up being about $100 more per household a year. Not much...

nappalachia, who paid for your education?

glenroy, money IS the issue. Sacramento keeps cutting education funding over and over again.

NVR, don't you think you should point out that this poll is completely unscientific? I have three registered voters in my house but only one of us can vote on this poll, because we only have one computer. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 7, 2009 12:50 PM:

" Naysayer, you are right, money is the issue, many people, myself included strongly believe, based on tax bills and where our state ranks in terms of tax rates (compared to the other states), that THERE IS ENOUGH MONEY BEING RAISED THROUGH CURRENT TAXES.

We just need to REDISTRIBUTE THEM MORE EFFECTIVELY.

The taxpayer has suffered from the death by a thousand (cuts) or (small and temporary) taxes.

I disagree that Napa does not support it's schools, we are currently paying 4 school bond measures.

How much is enough? How much inefficiency will be tolerated before even you say, we need to fix how we are spending the money we have before we throw more money into the obviously ineffective and inefficient system?

I fully support well funded public schools, having only ever attended public schools, however, there is so much obvious waste and inefficiency I cannot support any more money going into a broken system.

Fix the system and you will find a much higher level of support among the taxpaying public.

And the issue of the poll being non scientific is a red herring, everyone with a basic education should realize that this poll is not scientific, nor did the Register claim that it was. "

calfan wrote on Nov 7, 2009 6:19 PM:

" notanapanative, what is the obvious "waste and inefficiency" you see?

I am on my child's school site council and see not a penny being wasted. What I see is schools struggling to keep up with basic needs, like pencils and paper.

My child is fortunate to attend a school that has amazing parent participation and fundraising skills, but what about the schools that don't have that? You are willing to let those kids fall by the wayside while "the system" gets fixed? I, for one, am not. Especially not when it's only $100 a year. "

reader wrote on Nov 7, 2009 7:29 PM:

" Naysayer: If you have three of-age voters in your home then I can only assume that each has their own e-mail address. Each e-mail address gets one vote.

We have one computer in our home and two of-age voters. We each successfully voted on this issue. "

robert wrote on Nov 8, 2009 7:28 AM:

" Education, police and fire protection are all important. Why are they always the first to be threatened for a cut?! To scare us into approving more taxes? Priorities, please, people. There is a spending problem, not a revenue problem. We do not need more taxes, we need better managers. starting at the top of government. Hell no to ANY new taxes. "

nappalachia wrote on Nov 8, 2009 7:37 AM:

" Naysayer - My parents paid for my grade school and high school. I went to private schools. And I paid for college. "

broke wrote on Nov 8, 2009 7:54 AM:

" A hundred here and a hundred there. I paid 16K last year for private school. I really don't think the quality of education will improve until we take a hard look at the teachers, the gangs in the schools, and the parents that are aware and do nothing. This to me is where the real problem exists. "

Old Time Napkin wrote on Nov 8, 2009 8:12 AM:

" How much money are we spending in the schools on children of illegal aliens. Think of how much that is costing us. I don't have a problem paying for the education of children who have parents that are citizens,but I do have a problem with paying for those who are here illegally. "

alucawanza wrote on Nov 8, 2009 11:09 AM:

" broke
You're only 1/3 right. The real problem exists in the attitude and responsibility that students have when they come to school. Parents must be partners with the teacher. Look at your attitude. You paid 16K. I bet you expected your children to get your money's worth. You knew their teachers. You worked with them and had high expectations for all. You're a dream parent for any teacher, public or private.
What is the answer for the gangs?
Teachers are evaluated every other year by their principals. Maybe we should take a "hard look" at principals and the evaluation process. It takes three years to get permanent status. A teacher may be dismissed during those three years with poor evaluations. The principal must do his/her work...
You can read a copy of the contract teachers have with the district at the NVEA website. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 8, 2009 12:00 PM:

" Where is the waste?

How about with the ridiculous level of administration in schools/boards?

We need to look at EVERY compensation package, and weigh it against the private sector to determine competitiveness (we need to include retirement and other non wage items, and remember that the current school year is only 180 days while most of us work around 240 days/year ).

We need to be able to accurately measure and eliminate underperforming teachers, administrators etc., not just the ones who commit crimes.

When was the last time someone lost their job due to poor performance, rather than layoff, or because they committed a crime?

We have some great employees, a large number of good employees and a few bad ones. Unfortunately due to the contracts in place we do not get rid of the bad/marginal ones, they just keep their job year after year, to the detriment of the students and the other good employees.

I fully support well run and effective schools, I do not support the current wasteful and ineffective system.

Lets fix the system and then see if we actually need to spend more money.

We have been shoveling money at the school system for decades and getting worse results year after year.

We have 4 Bond measures that we are paying for now. When is enough?

Address the systemic issues and you will certainly have my support once the system is more efficient, effective and accountable.

Until then I will vote no on every new tax increase or "fee".

PS:When I went to school I had to bring my own pencil & paper.

When did that change? "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 8, 2009 12:38 PM:

" Alucawanza,

You have hit the nail on the head!

Parents, students and the entire school establishment need to be responsible and held accountable.

All parties have their share of the blame.

My issue as a taxpayer is how inefficient and ineffective the schools are.

If it is true what you suggest about Principles evaluating a teacher every second year, and that teachers become "permanent" after three is a huge problem to me.

My expectation as an employee is to get a review every year, why should we think teachers are any different?

Furthermore no one should EVER be "permanent" if you are not doing your job properly, you need to get help from your supervisor.

If after that you still cannot perform your job, then you need to be exited from your position. Since when did your job become a right?

It is a simple agreement, do the job to a certain level and you get to keep it.

Fail at it and we will help you do better.

If you still cannot do it then you need to be removed.

Maybe this is one reason why the students are performing so poorly. "

Cadence wrote on Nov 8, 2009 12:44 PM:

" Maybe if the money were spent to bribe absent parents to show up, maybe I'd vote for it.
Otherwise I don't see how ANY amount of money can make a whit's diference. "

grapegirl wrote on Nov 8, 2009 12:49 PM:

" I think it's time all of the administrator's salaries were made public again. "

marigold83 wrote on Nov 8, 2009 2:18 PM:

" No I would not support this. The reason I will not is because I see the waste the schools make. First reason maybe the school district should use the money from the California lottery for the kids and not for a bonus for the school district staff. I know they do this because I know people who work or have worked for the district that get the bonus every year. The second reason I have seen the waste of supplies they throw away at the end of every school year. This would be brand new pencils, glue sticks, and school books. I have heard they do this so they get money next school year, but the waste I have seen is just crazy. To calffan I can see how they struggle for paper and pencils because they throw them away. "

kck wrote on Nov 8, 2009 5:10 PM:

" OK. I am very sympathetic to the money problems. I really am. I wish I could do more. But I can not and will not vote for ANY new "anything." I'm at the point now where I am almost ready to give my house to the assessor. It is ridiculous. WHO IS IT, that has the money that keeps voting these assessments and fee's in. I SURE DON'T!! Absolutely no one I know can afford anything else tagged on to their tax bill. IT IS KILLING US. I thought it would be a great idea to stay in my house and add on so my family had room to breath. To anyone considering this, DON'T DO IT! Be sure to find out what you taxes will be prior to deciding to add on to your home. I built something at an unheard of cost of 52.00 a sq. ft. But my assessment is based on "comparable costs" not actual costs. So all the hard work and scrimping to get materials and do a good job, just cost you in the end. AND don't do a good job or take any pride in your work. THAT COSTS YOU MORE. It's called the "quality of construction." So do a crappy job, get it assessed and then go back and make it how you want it after everyone is gone. OK so I got off topic. The point is, at some point we need to stop taxing ourselves, or just give up and leave everything to the rich. Robin Hood comes to mind a lot lately. Maybe I could just give my house and belonging to the school district. NOTHING ELSE. "

flyinryan wrote on Nov 8, 2009 7:32 PM:

" robert you said it buddy, its sooooo easy spend less then you bring in! If the schools had officials that knew how to budget rather than complain about how much MORE money they need we wouldn't have this problem, If we gave the school 10 million more they would find a way to BLOW it and say they NEED more. It will never be enough. I think they need to learn how to work with what they have! "

bdnf wrote on Nov 8, 2009 9:29 PM:

" Talk is cheap. It's easy to claim that our public schools waste money, but such claims don't wash with anyone familiar with how hard school districts squeeze every penny.

And who ultimately decides these often difficult, if not heartbreaking, budgets? Local elected officials, school boards, that's who. Is that local democracy, or what?

Maybe some who say great sums are being wasted should come to their local school board meetings with ideas and numbers. Test how valuable your talk is in the real world. "

Piquemyinterest wrote on Nov 9, 2009 4:24 AM:

" No...I'm not for a Parcel Tax! I already am paying for the bond measures for Napa Valley College. Just because I'm a home owner I shouldn't be penalized for it and taxed to pay for a flawed system. Alot of people don't have children but yet they must pay for them. Renters don't have to pay this tax which is unfair as they have kids. The first bond measure for NV College didn't cover the cost and then they resubmitted another measure to finish the work. I'm tired of paying for others kids and also getting work furloughs which further cuts my check down. If you want payment then everyone should pay not just the home owners. This is discrimatory! Taxes should be spread across the board regardless of income or employment. Some people are hit especially hard since they are State workers and others aren't getting any tax cuts. You do the math! If these tax burdens continue against homeowners then people won't buy homes and will move out of state. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 9, 2009 7:42 AM:

" At the heart of the issue is simple economics, (the study of scarcity).

There will NEVER be enough money to do everything everyone wants/needs.

Usually when people make economic decisions for themselves they factor in both sides of the equation, the costs and benefits, as they have to both pay for their choice and they benefit from their decision, so they reach a (we hope) rational decision.

The problem with all government services and schools in particular is that the people who benefit from the increased spending (students, school employee's & administrators, the unions) are disproportionately affected by the benefits and only have to pay a small portion of the total costs (their own share of the taxes).

If we were to apply this same model to say car purchases (so that we could get to work) we would all advocate for whatever the most expensive (or tricked out) car, as we wouldn't have to pay the true cost of the vehicle because the "taxpayer" is helping us buy it "for the common good"(of getting to work to pay our taxes).

Now I grant you that this is a long extension of the principle, but it is the same principle (public funding of a desired public good).

We need to find some way to get the people who financially benefit the most (school administrators, teachers & the unions), out of the debate as to how much to spend and focus them on how to spend what we the taxpayer give them, efficiently and effectively.

Let them focus on how to do their jobs, not on how much they can get for their jobs.

Nobody in this economy or the one from a decade ago EVER has enough resources, schools are no different. "

napabicycler wrote on Nov 9, 2009 8:43 AM:

" Just can’t let the desk fiasco go. Same people are still running things, aren’t they? I vote NO. "

amazed wrote on Nov 9, 2009 9:04 AM:

" It's inequitable, and it's more support for an inefficient system, but yes, reluctantly, I would support such a tax. It's one of the few ways money can be raised locally AND we can be sure it's kept local. "

napamouth wrote on Nov 9, 2009 9:51 AM:

" It depends on how big the box is! Uh, I vote no!!!

(Definition:par·cel (pärsl) KEY
NOUN: Something wrapped up or packaged; a package) "

realitybites wrote on Nov 9, 2009 10:28 AM:

" Why should people without children pay for this? Save the planet, wear a condom. Home school your kid or pay for private education. Stop making others pay to educate your child. "

pate wrote on Nov 9, 2009 10:40 AM:

" We are currently paying close to 40% of our property taxes to various school districts and bond issues. As a home owner, without children, it seems that I am now paying my fair share. I believe it might be time for those with children to kick in a bit more toward their children's education. If each family provided a stipend of $5-10 dollars per month, instead of paying $40-50 per month for cell phones for each child, we could probably bridge that economic gap real quick. Unfortunately, at this time I think the days of a totally free education are gone. Hopefully things will turn around in the future, but until then parents will have to foot part of the tab. "

mom2boys wrote on Nov 9, 2009 10:40 AM:

" It is incorrect to assume that renters don't pay these parcel taxes. I'm a renter and I'm certain the parcel taxes, as well as all of the other expenses of homeownership (mortgage, insurance, homeowners' association dues) are figured into the rent that I pay.

It is also a mistake to think that because you don't have children you are not responsible for education. Who do you think will be providing the services you need in the next 20-30 yrs? Who will your doctor be? It's like saying if you don't have a car you don't have to pay the taxes that go to maintaining roads. Very poor logic. "

jack27022003 wrote on Nov 9, 2009 12:06 PM:

" I already pay about $2500 per year in property taxes. I have no problem with paying more for the schooling of children that are born here to legal parents. I have one neighbor, that has an illegal son, that has fathered 3 children. He pays no taxes. Is this fair to us? No. There has to be a limit to how many children of illegals that are allowed, before they are DEPORTED. It already costs each tax payer about $2500 per year for each illegal in this country. Remember, there is a limit to how many years a person can collect welfare, and they get no raise when they have more children .
At the very least, there must be a big tax on illegals to have their children in our schools. How many more billions are we going to have to pay for their big families?
No, I do not agree to another tax increase. Send some home that are not supposed to be here. "

Paddy wrote on Nov 9, 2009 12:16 PM:

" I believe parents/guardians should be paying for a students education, regardless of the cost. My parents paid for my private school education while paying taxes to educate other childeren. But these children were lifelong friends and neighbors; people we'd see in church; play basketball and baseball with.

Times are changing. I don't want to continue to pay for those who come to this country to live on the backs of generations of Californios. It's not my state anymore, it's hardly my country.

If those who come here illegally understand they will not be given free education, section 8 housing, free medical, welfare, etc. then they won't be so quick to flood our borders. It's clear why CA ranks at the bottom in education in this country. It's not because our children aren't stupid.

When that crisis ends then we can discuss yet another tax to pay for public education. "

zamersmith wrote on Nov 9, 2009 1:31 PM:

" Supporting a parcel tax so the School district can generate some additional revenue. Hummmm. . . . .Is this not what bond sales and bakes sales are for.

Oh wait, one of the last bond sales Measure M used money to a build multi-purposes room for a school (Carneros Elementary) which the school board now wants to close. Seeing as they have no exist strategy for this school and the money that will have been wasted (if closed), I bet they'd have a hard time getting another one passed.

Secondly, the School Board has a "Rain Day" account that collects interest, and at last disclosure there was a good junk of funding that was available. I would think these economic times would qualify for using this fund, as economically this country is in a "Biblical Flood".

Lastly, every other agency and household for that matter has had to become creative in looking for fund to balance budgets without raising taxes. Why so we have to pay for them not to do the same? How about eliminating non-essentials? Like the car allowance the Super Intendant receives along with his annual salary?

So the short answer to this poll is. . . No, and I live in the school district boundaries

I just hope the school board takes into account the information portrayed on this informal poll, when it comes down to decide on spending money to create a formal poll as has been mentioned in past School Board Meetings. "

orual wrote on Nov 9, 2009 1:45 PM:

" notanapanative wrote:
"When was the last time someone lost their job due to poor performance, rather than layoff, or because they committed a crime?"

The answer to that would be just last year. It happens much more than people think so don't be so gullible to believe right wing propaganda. It is a lie to say that public school teachers can't be fired for poor performance. Since I began teaching at public schools three years ago, I have seen this happen twice. "

LMW wrote on Nov 9, 2009 2:29 PM:

" Heartbreaking we must choose what is good for our kids simply because of past performance...and that is sad because its noticeable in our schools where we can improve and are not.

Parcel tax is need but not fair. I believe many options are there for funding mechanism and our leadership not just in education should be weighing in here.... "

frenchtoast wrote on Nov 9, 2009 3:42 PM:

" I'm not clear why we need a POLL when it appears from the voters on this article (currently 73%) WHY they would spend nearly $17k on it. Spend THAT on the schools not a stupid poll. "

naysayer wrote on Nov 9, 2009 5:13 PM:

" Frenchtoast, because relying on this unsceintific poll - THAT would be completely irresponsible.

Do you really think all registered voters read the Napa Register's blogs? Or even klow they exist? I don't. So, other than being interesting (I guess) this poll online doesn't count for anything.

Thank you amazed and mom2boys for being logical and thoughtful in your posts- it seems to be a rare commodity around here. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 9, 2009 5:30 PM:

" Orual, you correctly quoted my question, which upon reflection was poorly worded.

It should have read: how often does someone with "tenure" or otherwise considered "permanent" ie past the 3 year seniority mark been eliminated for poor performance.

Just because you are performing acceptably for the first 3 years, does not mean you are performing acceptably thereafter.

Moreover my point was also that it is unacceptable for anyone to receive a review every other year.

That is unacceptable in the private sector, and it shouldn't fly in the school system either.

My argument is that we seem to have institutionalized mediocrity in the school system at all levels.

Unless and until we break that, we will not get better results for or from our students.

We need to get the entrenched interests, that look after themselves out of the school funding debate and focus each group on what it is accountable for. Students need to learn, teachers teach, administrators and school boards need to run the schools. We the taxpayer need to set school funding levels, with an eye to actual needs.

It is unreasonable to allow the teachers, administrators and unions to be included in the school funding debate, they benefit directly from increased taxes for schools.

Those same groups (except the unions) should be focussed on meeting the needs of the students with the funds designated by the taxpayer.

The unions should be focussed on ensuring the teachers in the system know what is expected from them and to make sure they are measured fairly to those same standards.

To listen to any argument from any group that directly benefits from increased school spending should be immediately discounted due to a lack of objectivity. "

NVR-Dan Ross wrote on Nov 9, 2009 5:50 PM:

" frenchtoast:
This is not a scientific poll, this is an opportunity for our readers to weigh in with their views. Remember we have a huge number of readers from outside the school district boundaries and we can only assume people are being truthful about where they live when they answer this online poll.
--Dan "

kevin wrote on Nov 9, 2009 7:23 PM:

" What makes anyone think the poll by the school district will be "scientific"?

You never heard of a "push poll"?

If the poll is going to take 15 minutes, that would lend me to believe it will be that type, where the results are already predetermined... "

frenchtoast wrote on Nov 9, 2009 7:42 PM:

" Yes, understanding this is not a scientific poll and not an adequate reflection of how all Napa residents feel on the subject, the overwhelming NO says a lot to me. I don't own a house AND I support schools being supported through bonds, measures, bake sales, etc., but I don't like the idea of spending so much on a poll. How bout add it to the next voting measures? This seems like a waste of money! "

naysayer wrote on Nov 9, 2009 8:04 PM:

" Frenchtoast, you are missing the point of the poll. The point of the poll the school district is doing is to see if there is support of the parcel tax. If there isn't, then they shouldn't waste the money trying to get it on the ballot and then trying to get it passed. Which will be a LOT more than $16k.

And your repeated suggestion of "bake sales" as a potential solution to this problem doesn't lend you any credibility either.

We are talking about millions of dollars in shortfalls for education in Napa alone - no amount of bake sales will cover that loss. "

LMW wrote on Nov 9, 2009 8:30 PM:

" let me get in here Nayguy!

Does $400,000 sound like a little change and I will add the enforcement we pay to patrol what the $400,000 didn't do for a school anyway....Do not underestimate the frustrations in how we allow school district to spend our dollars....until we get common sense in our leadership, hopefully we may help Sacramento.. "

naysayer wrote on Nov 9, 2009 9:18 PM:

" LMW, I am sorry but I have no idea what you are talking about. Could you clarify? "

LMW wrote on Nov 9, 2009 10:35 PM:

" Naysay, I'm for smart planning around our children. I wish we were careful how we look at that built environment in their schools or anywhere children are. Our school is addressing a traffic problem and it was the design that was missed. The projects design to beautify our school and it is a wonderful new look, we simply forgot the importance of safe routes in our schools. Flow of traffic needs to move and our new look did not resolve that important need. So it is about SRTS to the rescue:) "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 10, 2009 6:04 AM:

" Frenchtoast, the only arguments that are rational are the ones that support more taxes for schools?

Is it rational that taxpayers want to make sure the system in fixed so that more of the money raised goes to benefit the students directly, rather than being wasted by a massive bureaucracy?

Is it rational to want well educated students year after year at a reasonable and sustainable rate of taxation?

Why is it that opposing a "NEW" tax is irrational?

Depending on the information you look at California ranks somewhere in the top 10 in the union for the tax rate it's citizens pay.

Why is it irrational to oppose further tax increases?

Is it that since this is your cause any who oppose it are not rational?

Many are opposing all new taxes because we are wanting to fix the system so we get more EFFECTIVE and EFFICIENT spending.

It is completely unacceptable that we have such poor results in our schools.
We need to reform the whole system so that our students get a BETTER education.

I have only ever attended public school and believe it is a responsibility of the community to provide good schools for all students.

We are not doing so now.

The only difference in our position is how we achieve that goal.

The parcel tax supporters would like to throw more money at the problem.

I and others would like to fix an obviously broken system.

We have the same goal just different ways of achieving it. "

nappalachia wrote on Nov 10, 2009 7:16 AM:

" ....and why does the federal govt. give a tax CREDIT (not a deduction, a CREDIT) to those who have children? Maybe they should reverse that and tax children. A federal child tax of $1,000 would pay for alot of education. "

napavalley35 wrote on Nov 10, 2009 9:03 AM:

" Im also not willing to wait until the "system" gets fixed to fund these bonds, thats an issue far larger than Napa. The school district needs the money. Ask any employee or parent involved with the school district. Do your research and look at the school systems that vote down their bonds, the schools are in dire straights. BANKRUPT. There is no money for modernization and there are no supplies. That is a fact. I live in Napa so that my children as well as others can have a great education. I was educated on other hard working people's money in public schools and grew up to be a college graduate and now a tax payer. If the schools are subpar the town will become subpar. "

dellasumbrella wrote on Nov 10, 2009 9:23 AM:

" We pay just under 10% of our property tax to schools now (including community college), and we've never had children, yet I'd pay more if it was needed.

I'd prefer that all children have the opportunity to be educated. If they're here illegally, it's not by their own doing; if we want them to learn to speak English and learn the American Way, I think it's wise to make sure they receive a proper education. Otherwise you're condemning them (and us) to illiteracy, poverty, crime, and gangs.

I don't see anyone who's complaining about "waste" coming up with any real evidence of what that "waste" is. What is it?

How do you who complain about teachers not doing their jobs know they're not doing their jobs? There are many complexities involved in teaching/learning. What about the role of the parents in encouraging their children? What about the role of society in fostering a respect for education? What about the role of toy manufacturers in creating computer games that enhance a desire to learn instead of enhancing a desire to fight wars and commit crimes?

It benefits me when the children in my community have schools that are adequately funded.

But along with that funding, I think we need to look at our expectations. Maybe if we stopped trying to push square pegs through round holes and had an education system that accommodates those who have no interest in academics but can still have a significant role in society, we'd have more success. We need a return to vocational, skills, and specialized preparation for those who are not going to excel in academic3s. And we might adjust our thinking on testing as well. "

cfpotter wrote on Nov 10, 2009 9:28 AM:

" I am a parent of two children that attend public school in Napa and I still vote NO! I would much rather purchase school supplies and hard goods that the schools need than send another penny to ANY government. I am sick and tired of being taxed to death. and seeing nothing good come of it. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 10, 2009 9:36 AM:

" napavalley35 wrote "Ask any employee or parent involved with the school district"

Unfortunately by definition these folks are NOT objective as they will benefit from an increase in funding, DISPROPORTIONATELY to the amount they will have to pay (as taxpayers).

Please remember that the amount we pay in taxes HAS NOT DECREASED!

We are talking about AN INCREASE IN THE TAX BURDEN.

NVUSD must adjust for the change in the economy LIKE EVERY ONE ELSE!

Failure to do so proves their ineffectiveness.

The poor performance to date is unacceptable and further reinforces the need to change the system.

Napa is a very wealthy district, many across the country would like to have it's level of funding!

We have 4 current school bonds that the taxpayers are supporting.

How much is enough?

When will the "professionals" who run the district and make 6 figures be held accountable for the poor performance of their mission?

When will we address the fact that teachers make full time salaries while only working 75% of the year (180 days vs. 240 days per year)?

When will we address the failing performance of our students?

Performing up to grade level is merely adequate, and we cannot achieve that effectively.

I am not willing to pay one more cent until the system is changed and the people who make money from the system are held accountable for the results.

As to the issue of supplies, I was always required to bring my own supplies, the only thing that was supplied was the textbooks.

Perhaps having parents pay for notebooks etc ought to be part of what parents supply, not taxpayers, just a thought. "

pat wrote on Nov 10, 2009 10:00 AM:

" For those who think that spending 16k on a poll is irresponsible, let’s first consider where things currently stand.

In the last year, NVUSD has done the following: laid off teachers, reduced/restructured administration staff, increased class sizes in K-3, did not fund cost of living adjustments to teachers, increased fees to play sports, cut transportation, and decreased funding to all school sites.

For this year and next year, NVUSD is looking at furlough days, closing/consolidating small schools, increasing class size yet again for K-3, and laying off even more teachers. Also included will be more fees and additional decreases in school site funding.

Why? Is it because NVUSD is “throwing the money away”? No. It is because for the fourth year in a row, the State of California will slash funding for Education.

So, we as a community need to decide whether education is important enough to us to fund what the State will not. Will we choose to make education a priority? I don’t know. But if we don’t ask the question (poll the community), we won’t know. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 10, 2009 10:32 AM:

" Pat, we as a community have voted and currently pay for 4 school bonds!

Our taxes have not decreased one cent!

I would say that given the crux of this discussion is not whether to publicly fund schools BUT rather to pay an ADDITIONAL tax.

It seems to me that the reality of the situation is that the tax burden is already high for all taxpayers, yet spending is not meeting some peoples requests and perceived needs.

So maybe the question to be discussed is what other programs need to be cut in order to get more funding to schools.

Any suggestions?

I will not support any new taxes, no matter what they are used for, until we reform how the money is spent, so that we get accountability for results.

How may of the layoffs were from tenured or "permanent" teachers?

How may of these tenured or "permanent" teachers are removed for poor performance?

If anyone in the private sector had the test results that our schools do there would be significant terminations for performance reasons.

Why are the NVUSD administrators paid so much, given the poor performance of the schools?

Lets address the performance issue, spend the existing funds wisely and then discuss whether additional taxes would be supported by the local residents. "

pat wrote on Nov 10, 2009 11:41 AM:

" Notanapan,

You stated “I will not support any new taxes, no matter what they are used for”.

That is fine, but I simply suggest that you think about what that will do to the education of the 17,000 kids in this school district this next year, and the year after. You can talk all day long about reform and accountability, but what are you doing to this end? What are you specifically doing to create reform or accountability? Let me guess, you are simply voting no on anything and everything that might cost you a buck until someone else fixes what you see as the problem.

You assert that administrators are paid too much, and existing funds are not wisely spent. Are you comparing salaries to like sized districts? Are you comparing level of education and professional experience and responsibility to private sector jobs? Please show me some examples.

On second thought, don’t bother. You said it yourself. You will not support any new taxes, no matter what they are used for. But remember, a quote by Derek Bok - If you think education is expensive, try ignorance. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 10, 2009 1:05 PM:

" Pat, you left out half of my statement.

At least show me enough respect to copy my entire sentence so that everyone can read what I said ACCURATELY.

Since you would not, let me, "I will not support any new taxes, no matter what they are used for, until we reform how the money is spent, so that we get accountability for results."

I suppose I should expect to be hated for wanting such a horrible thing as ACCOUNTABILITY for THE MONEY WE ALREADY SPEND.

Why is it such a terrible concept to get reform/results BEFORE raising taxes?

Is it because you have some direct entrenched financial interest?

I only have a indirect interest, as I am neither a teacher, not school administrator or other school employee.

As such my opinion is at least OBJECTIVE.

I will not benefit from an increase in taxes.

Why can we not discuss the level of spending and the results we expect to get from our schools?

Why can we not discuss why our schools are organized so inefficiently?

Why is it that those being asked to pay for something are criticized for asking for accountability of money already collected from us.

Why do you oppose me questioning how MY TAX money is spent, last I heard we have the right to question our elected officials.

Please don't be so quick to criticize someone who wants the schools to perform better, just because they expect the people being paid handsomely, to show appropriate results.

When those results aren't acceptable why can we not get normal (private sector) reactions (terminate underperforming administrators, & teachers)? "

John Richards wrote on Nov 10, 2009 1:15 PM:

" You wrote: "Are you comparing level of education..."

Immaterial. I could have a masters in basketweaving, but that doesn't mean I should be paid the same as someone with a masters in rocket engineering. Pay should be based on supply and demand in that specific profession, not on what the unions can manage to strongarm out of the politicians. "

pat wrote on Nov 10, 2009 3:05 PM:

" Notanapan,
You have many questions, that is great, but you seem to make even more assumptions, most of which are incorrect. But, to show you “enough respect”, I will not use cap lock while pointing them out.
I do not understand why you think people should hate you for wanting accountability for the money that is being spent. Actually, it is the law. NVUSD’s financials are audited annually by an independent outside firm, who has given the district extremely high ratings for accounting for how the district spends its money. Public record, you can look it up.
You wonder why we should invest back locally the money the State has stripped from our children’s education before a system wide reform. In my opinion, reform takes time, years most likely, and while needed, the need to educate children can not be put on hold until it is complete. "

pat wrote on Nov 10, 2009 3:07 PM:

" Notanapan,

You also make the incorrect assumption that because I am in favor of paying for a parcel tax that will most likely be around $100 a year, I must have “some entrenched financial interest” and that my opinion is not “objective”. I have no such financial interest. I do have an interest in the children that go through NVUSD get a quality education. I do have an interest in keeping class size small in K-3, keeping kids in the classroom and not “furloughed”, in keeping arts and science as part of the curriculum, and that those that want to play sports will have the opportunity.

You state that you “will not benefit from an increase in taxes. I disagree. If you look a bit beyond yourself, you will see that the better we educate the kids in this community, the better adults these kids can become. This benefits us all.

You ask about discussions regarding the level of spending and the results we get from our schools, about how schools are organized, and the right to question our elected officials. There is a very simple answer to that. It is called a school board meeting. They have them twice a month and sometimes a few extra ones. Spoiler alert: this is the very stuff they talk about, and you can ask questions. But you will have to move out of the blogs and step up to the podium. "

zamersmith wrote on Nov 10, 2009 4:05 PM:

" Pat, accountability is lacking at the School Board. As an example:

They plan to close Carneros school. 2 years ago funds were used from Measure M to build a new Multi-Purpose room (which according to district records cost roughly $2 million). The school board has no exit plan, and still hasn’t address the question nearly 1 month later after first being asked at the 10/15 School Board Meeting. In addition, as of October’s disclosure $7 million dollars is still available to fund projects listed under Measure M.

I have 1 niece and 2 children who attend Carneros. Being involved with the school, I know parents, students, faculty and administration are all involved to do whatever it takes to keep the school opened.

The students developed a recycling/compost program to cut down on the waste the school produces.

Faculty/Staff created a Magnet School Charter, which are supposed to get additional funding per the School Board, only to be ignored and not included in the plan for Magnet Schools.

The parents maintain and harvest a vineyard located on school grounds. Also parents volunteer to put on Family Fun Day, an end of the year fund raiser, which solicits denotations from all over California. Proceeds from the grape sale and Family Fun day go directly back to the school to fund new classroom equipment.

Lastly, all involved at the school are seeking out grants to procure equipment to outfit the school with Solar and Wind power.

Personally, the School Board hasn’t done enough to seek out alternatives prior to closing schools and raising taxes. If Carneros can come up with innovative ways to do their part, it is only reasonable and should be expected the School Board does the same. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 10, 2009 4:18 PM:

" Pat,

We both want the same thing, great schools.

Where we differ is whether or not we are willing to cap how much we are prepared to pay before we expect to see change.

You have not yet reached that limit, I (with 4 school bonds,very high property, sales, and State taxes & fees (DMV etc.)) have.

I am not keeping you from contributing any more, in fact I encourage you to donate to your local school, they apparently feel they need it.

Where we are in conflict is the push by folks like yourself to contribute more than we already do to the schools.

We are in the top 10 of the most taxed states in the union, and it is not enough.

How much is enough?

I agree reform takes time, my question is why has it not started already?

Why has school performance been allowed to founder year after year?

The people of Napa deserve better performance out of the school system than they have received.

I think it is entirely normal to expect people who have not been involved in the system, to ask many pointed questions, when you propose forcing them to contribute even more than they already do to a failing system.

I point out the groups that benefit from increased school spending as they appear to skate by with unacceptable performance while raising their own wages.

I disagree with that approach and lack of accountability.

I will also use capitalization WHEN I AM SELECTIVELY QUOTED IN AN EFFORT TO DISTORT MY VIEWS.

Fyi: Caps lock is the key that facilitates capitalization. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 10, 2009 4:44 PM:

" Pat, You have suggested that I do not support great education and opportunity for our students.

You are completely wrong!

I believe that we should have great schools, and should make it possible for students to reach their true potential.

However, I do not believe that ever increasing taxes is the solution.

We need to talk about holding administrators, teachers and all NVUSD employees accountable to the role they are responsible for.

Acceptable performance needs to be directly tied to job retention and compensation, not seniority.

The NVUSD and the associated employee groups have a vested financial interest in discussing how they are "shorted money from the state".

The more relevant question is have you met you performance objectives and have you spent the money you have received effectively and efficiently.

If the answer is no to either one of these questions then we need to either make changes to the way the person is doing their job, or if this is a continual problem, we need to change the person and find someone else.

Why is it that the NVUSD, administrators, teachers etc. steadfastly refuse to take responsibility for the poor performance of the system/students?

Year after year we are turning out students that perform below grade level, why is that tolerated?

I will not willingly pay ADDITIONAL taxes until I see reform that brings meaningful improvement to school performance.

If you and others would like to contribute additional funds to an ineffective and wasteful system, that is your prerogative.

Please note that if you attempt to FORCE me into paying more (without any effective reform) I will oppose the effort very vocally and at the ballot box. "

So It Goes wrote on Nov 10, 2009 4:55 PM:

" Notanapanative,
Thanks for your posts.
You’re making legitimate points and doing it quite effectively.

Although I’m not sure if you have received the complete truth in regards to your question on “objectivity” and people having a personal “financial interest” in this matter.

Saying the “not the complete truth” is not calling someone a liar, just they may look at things sideways in responding to your question. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 10, 2009 6:49 PM:

" So it Goes,

Thank you for the kind words.

I agree that many people may stretch the definition of objective.

I amazed at how groups that directly benefit financially from spending through increased taxes get away with advocating for higher taxes.

I suppose it is human nature to want to improve your financial position, even if someone else has to pay for it.

Which is why I insist that the only valid opinions are "objective" opinions, everyone else is just feathering their own nest at someone else's expense.

Many of the people who are advocating for the parcel tax also appear to be drawing their salaries from the Napa Taxpayer.

While simultaneously avoiding (year after year) any accountability for the poor performance of our students.

We have some great employees, many good employees and a few bad ones. I simply want the system to throw out the bad and ineffective ones, regardless if the have tenure or are "permanent".

This accountability needs to start at the top with the NVUSD, and the school administrators. It needs to continue through the teachers ranks and to all school employees.

If you excel at your role, you deserve a promotion and a raise, if you are bad or ineffective you deserve to get help, and if sufficient improvement is not seen, then you need to be terminated.

This happens every day in the real world, why should the school system be any different.

Results are results.

President Obama is even advocating a pay for merit system.

The logical extension of that proposal is that you terminate for non performance.

Napa's students and taxpayers deserve better than it has received from the NVUSD. "

aremotelocation wrote on Nov 10, 2009 10:16 PM:

" zamersmith, you make some good points, yet you are missing some basic points about how school district funding works. For example, you criticize the school board for building the new multi-use room at Carneros. We, the voters, approved this project, and it would be illegal for the school board to have stopped the construction at that point. The school is open, the voters approved the new construction - it's got to be done. As messed up as that may be - it is state law.

Your criticism of the board for "ignoring" the magnet charter that the staff created - well...a proposal is just that. Doesn't mean it will make the cut.

I appreciate all that Carneros does to build community and raise money. It sounds like it might not be enough. Other schools do that, and a lot more.

I hate that the school budget situation given to us by the state puts us in this horrible place. There are no easy answers, but I would rather have our local officials make decisions than the far removed people in our state government. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 11, 2009 7:29 AM:

" aremotelocation, you raise some very interesting points about what we the voters mandated.

I do have 2 questions related to Measure M.

1)What was the NVUSD position on Measure M?

2)Are there any other legal uses for the remaining Measure M funds ($7 million is a lot of money)?

My other comment is that as Napa residents, I feel (and I could be wrong about this) that we have done our job in facilitating local bonds to build schools etc ( 4 school bond charges).

The budget issue seems to be the annual operating budget, not the construction/capital budget.

As I understand the funding formula, every district gets the same funding per student from Sacramento.

Is this correct?

If yes, then the NVUSD should be no worse off than any other district in the state, yet I do not see additional taxes being advocated in every other county.

If I am incorrect about how the funding is allocated from the state, then we need to protest in Sacramento that we are being unfairly shorted.

In either case the question as to whether or not the NVUSD is doing it's job has been answered.

IF we get the same funds per student as everyone else (from the state) then the NVUSD has failed us for being unable to do what other School Districts have done, managed the budget.

If we do not get the same funds per student from the state then I need to ask why?

We certainly pay the same state tax as everyone else.

In any case the issue of unacceptable student performance still needs to be answered for by the NVUSD. "

napavalley35 wrote on Nov 11, 2009 9:14 AM:

" Just look at Vallejo City Unified School Distirct. Its in the news. They vote down their bonds. Enough said. That is what will happen here. As stated above that the people for the bond are paid by public funding is false. I work for private industry, nothing to do with State, Federal or local funding mechanisms. I cannot change the "system" but I can do my small part. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 11, 2009 9:49 AM:

" Napavalley35, so after paying for 4 school bonds, the rest of my property taxes, sales tax, local, state and federal taxes I am not doing my part?

When is enough?

How much more inefficiency and poor performance will you tolerate before you demand change?

We are on the same continuum just at different points along it, we both want to provide great schools.

I am just unwilling to continue enabling a wasteful underperforming system that lacks any real accountability.

The sooner we demand change the sooner our students can benefit.

We hold our kids accountable for their choices and actions, why not the NVUSD and the rest of the school system.

I agree with your assertion denying that all people supporting the tax are all on the public payroll.

My point is that we should question the motives and discount their views if someone directly financially benefits from an increase in taxes.

It is called objectivity.

By definition you do not have an objective opinion if you financially benefit from the tax.

Even I might support a parcel tax that puts more money directly in my pocket as well, it is human nature.

We often hear the phrase "follow the money".

When we follow the school money, it leads directly to the NVUSD administrators, principals, teachers, and all NVUSD employees.

So anyone affiliated (employed by, married to etc.)needs to have their motives for supporting the tax questioned.

There are people who are not affiliated with the NVUSD who support the parcel tax, and they are entitled to their opinions, just as I am mine.

To them I ask, when will we hold the NVUSD accountable for it's poor performance? "

pat wrote on Nov 11, 2009 11:30 AM:

" Notanapan

You have many questions, and unfortunately do not like my answers to them. You question school performance. The answer is virtually every school in NVUSD has test scores that have improved year on year. Look beyond the school’s overall score and look at the subgroups and you will see that they too have improved in most cases. It is fact, you can look it up. Now you can say that they need to improve more, or faster, and that would be a fair statement. But keep in mind the change in demographics and you can see the challenge they face.

You asked if NVUSD gets the same money per student as other districts. They do not. For example, St. Helena’s school district gets almost twice as much per student. Unfair? You bet. Do you think NVUSD and other districts are advocating reform for the way the State funds districts, you bet. But does that mean we should not support our district now?

You suggested that we both want the same thing but you have hit your limit with taxes and I have not. You are correct in that statement. I feel spending around $100 or so more on our kids is worthwhile.

Finally, I think it is a bit disingenuous of you to say that I, or anyone for that matter are attempting to “FORCE” (your caps) to pay for anything. I am not asking you to pay for anything. The NVUSD is not either, they are simply conducting a poll to determine what the outcome would be if they put a tax on the ballot for you to vote on. "

wine nurse wrote on Nov 11, 2009 11:36 AM:

" wow, hard question for me, if I am correct schools get paid for each child that attends school. When a child cuts school or stays home the school doesnt get paid.

My children are in College now but I can remember how many highschoolers would ditch a class here and there and everywhere= no payment for the school. "

dellasumbrella wrote on Nov 11, 2009 11:59 AM:

" Under the category of “weird news” at MSNBC – A middle school in North Carolina is selling 20 test points to students for $20, in an effort to raise money, since they didn’t do too well selling chocolate the year before. (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33854822/ns/us_news-weird_news/)

While the principal defends this fund-raising tactic by saying it won’t really raise anyone’s overall grade significantly, the decision has been criticized by those who say it sends the wrong message.

The school’s mission statement, according to its website, is as follows:

“The staff of Rosewood Middle School is committed to empowering adolescents through unique goal-directed learning in environments created for success with the support and participation of students, parents and community."

I have two multiple-choice questions (and if you get them wrong, I’ll let you have the points anyway for the bargain price of $9.99):

1. This fund-raising technique is wrong because

a. It gives the wrong message.
b. Buying a grade is tantamount to, if not worse than, cheating.
c. It perpetuates social inequity in that those who have, get (better grades, that is).
d. It’s a really heinous way to achieve the school’s mission statement.
e. All of the above.

2. Use of this fund-raising technique is a sign that

a. The principal wants to teach children the fine art of bribery.
b. Schools are horrifically underfunded if they have to go to such extremes to survive.
c. Some administrators in the public school system have lost their marbles.
d. Ethics are obsolete.

Here's your chance to excel in School Reform 101! "

montana wrote on Nov 11, 2009 12:05 PM:

" Zamersmith,

Just because the School Board disagrees with you they are lacking accountability? That makes no sense. I am in favor of Carneros being closed because I would like the school district to be more efficient with the use of the facilities. If it will save money that can be spent on a far larger group of kids then I say shut it down. The site does not educate the kids, the teachers do. As far as the multipurpose room or the whole site is concerned, no one has said it is going to be boarded up. Throw a charter school out there, then there budget can pay for it. I am for the best use for the greatest number of kids; we simply don’t have the money to do anything different.

That is great that you all raise money at your school. Most schools do that, and that isn’t a reason to keep it open. Do you really think Carneros (or any small school) could raise the kind of money they are talking about saving if they closed it? Really? Year after year? "

dellasumbrella wrote on Nov 11, 2009 12:09 PM:

" "Many of the people who are advocating for the parcel tax also appear to be drawing their salaries from the Napa Taxpayer."

I find that a disingenuous argument. It doesn't fit me -- I never had children in schools, Napa or elsewhere, and my household has no income from NVUSD.

Many people are interested in seeing schools thrive and have more to offer students merely because education is of prime importance to the community, the nation, and the world. And even studying and developing more effective ways to provide essential and optimum education costs money. It's not gonna happen magically, without funding. Unless, of course, there are enough parents around who can afford to give their kids $20 to pay to improve their grades, and enough schools that are willing to adopt that nefarious effort to raise money while reflecting inflated test scores. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 11, 2009 12:47 PM:

" Pat,

Thank you for clarifying that not all school districts receive the same funding per child.

After reading that, I did a little more research (Support Our Schools website (www.fgus.net)) and found that you are correct.

While reviewing data from the NVUSD you are correct that there has been improvement, unfortunately when we look at the big picture we end up with the following picture for NVUSD High School performance (to the state standard, not the tougher Federal standard: 50% of our students are proficient in English and Science, Math 44% are proficient, and only 38% are proficient in History/Social Sciences.

How is this miserable performance allowed to perpetuate?

This reflects years of mismanagement!

I most certainly do not have all of the answers, but looking at the data the NVUSD has on it's website causes me to think we don't need to change the system, but rather that we need to scrap it and start from scratch.

How does any administrator/teacher have their job with such poor numbers?

Just because other districts are doing poorly does not excuse our own district from making the obviously radical changes necessary to properly educate our students.

In reference to the comment of it only being an additional $100, I respond in 2 ways:
1) we do not know definitively yet how much the district will be asking for
2) you disregard or minimize the already significant amount paid to fund the schools.

You should be familiar with the term "death by a thousand cuts", many California Taxpayers are intimately familiar with this approach.

I also stand behind my statement that this or any tax is forced, unfortunately there is no opt out clause for taxation. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 11, 2009 1:00 PM:

" Dellasumbrella,

by all means many of us do not draw our income from the Taxpayer.

However, that does not invalidate the argument that if you do, you have a vested financial interest in supporting increased spending on schools.

My point was that "many" not "all" are in this situation.

I actually support strong sustainable public school funding (only ever having attended public school, including College). I am merely advocating that before we throw more money into the bottomless pit of the NVUSD money gobbling machine that we demand some reforms.

I also agree with you that the "buy a better grade" program described is abhorrent and at the very least the principal and any teacher who supported it should be terminated for such an obviously flawed program.

Academic dishonesty cannot be tolerated let alone promoted by the powers in charge.

Where is the accountability to the students and taxpayers for the performance and spending?

Without change I will not support any ADDITIONAL taxes.

After accountability for performance is implemented I would welcome the discussion as to what level of funding is appropriate for our schools.

Until then I am a sold No vote. "

zamersmith wrote on Nov 12, 2009 7:19 AM:

" aremotelocation,

The law on funds from voter approved bond sales is only items which where originally disclosed in the bond measure may receive funds from a voter approved bond sale. Just b/c it is listed on the measure is not a guarantee to receive funding from the bond sales.

Once the bond sales is approved what projects are funded in the measure is at the sole discretion of the people in charge of those funds.

Go to the NVUSD website and review the measures, and find out what has been funded and where funds still exists, and what projects are still outstanding.

http://www2.nvusd.k12.ca.us/homex.asp?Q=Homepage "

nappalachia wrote on Nov 12, 2009 7:31 AM:

" Why do we even have physical school facilities in this day and age of the internet? Children could stay home and receive their lessons via computer.
Oh, woops. I just remembered that it is my responsibility (as one without children) to subsidize your childcare so you can go to work. Couple that with a $1,000 federal child tax credit that I subsidize. "

ROSETHEB17 wrote on Nov 12, 2009 8:06 AM:

" Napkin, I totally agree with you on that one.. why should we pay for the illegals..?? I am fed up with paying for them and wont pay anymore to the schools. I buy most of my grandsons supplies every year.. If the district would stop giving themselves raises etc and want to build a new school and close others.. There is something wrong with the total system.. "

freeport56 wrote on Nov 12, 2009 8:49 AM:

" NO, ABSOLUTELY NO!

This is the same group of people that usede a ballot measure for cosmetic purposes, funded a pool w\out a lifeguard (cost $12k per month to maintain), the last thing on their minds was education.

They have been extremely poor decision makers, lacking a vision\plan for the future. They have lost my trust and I will not support any future taxes, bonds...etc.

I think this board needs to go away and some fresh thinkers brought in to analyze, reorganize, and reestablish trust within the community.

Just throwing money at a problem never solves it, it just perpetuates throwing more money away! "

zamersmith wrote on Nov 12, 2009 9:28 AM:

" montana,

I don't believe the School Board lacks accountability just b/c I disagree. Carneros has roughly 230 students, Mt. George has 175. Do you consider these small? I am opposed to their proposal to close Mt. George in the 2011-2012 school year. Mt. George is one school which serves Southeast Napa, and isn't near its campus capacity, meanwhile they reviews options to build a new school to serve Southeast Napa. How does this demonstrate accountability?

I understand schools don't educate our students, teachers do. However, in their plan, new classes won't be created at existing schools, the plan is to increase class sizes, which means teachers at a closed school can displace teachers at other schools, and those displaced teacher can displace other teachers, etc. How does this benefit students?

Why is it bad for people to hold officials accountable for their plans/actions? I think we've all experienced enough of just blindly follow b/c you are asked to do so. Accountability is on many levels from spending to planning. To me a lack of preparedness is a lack of accountability.

What if I told you the #1 interest listed for the School Boards master plan, the driving force of school closures, is "Balanced Diversity", while the last item is "Achieve efficiencies in operation and responsible use of District Facilities." Here is the link to the plan:

http://www2.nvusd.k12.ca.us/Projects/10/Program___Facilities_Master_Plan/Master_Plan_Overview_(Oct._15,_2009).pdf

Review the material, make yourself aware of the overall situation, don't just blindly follow people b/c they said it is the best option. There are other avenues that haven't been explored. And yes as a resident of Napa and parent of students in NVUSD, I am demanding them to be accountable for their current and future plans/actions, as everyone else should too! "

montana wrote on Nov 12, 2009 11:10 AM:

" Zamer,

Efficiency studies show that schools less that 300 -350 cost more money to run than schools that are 350 to 400 (or above). You need to factor in principals, part time aids, librarians, special ed aids, secretaries, janitors, etc and look at their incomes divided by the number of students. Fixed number of staff with fewer students = higher cost per student.

Nobody wants to increase class sizes, but look no further than this poll and no one wants to pay to keep them small either. If you want to talk about what benefits the students, start talking about funding education first. Everyone is saying the school district should live within its means, but when they increase class sizes or close a school everyone cries foul. You can’t have it both ways, and I for one would rather see a small school close because that impacts the fewest numbers of students.

There has been talk for years of closing Carneros, but people like you keep trying to keep it open. The school board has done so to this point, and now you accuse them of not being prepared. With that logic they should have closed it down years ago.

And I would love to hear what “avenues” have not been explored. And please, don’t say bake sale. You have a self interest in keeping Carneros open, that is fine, but that isn’t in the best interest of the rest of the school district. Don’t blame others for doing what is right for the entire school district. "

montana wrote on Nov 12, 2009 11:18 AM:

" nappalachia,

That right there is some messed up logic. You don’t have kids so your taxes should not pay for public education? How is this, I don’t have any family members incarcerated, should I have to pay for county jails or state prisons? Why not have the families of prisoners pay for it? I have never used any social services in my entire life, why should I pay for those either?

We pay for these things because the improve society. The better we educate our kids the better and more skilled adults they become (and less likely to end up in jail or need social services). "

zamersmith wrote on Nov 12, 2009 12:46 PM:

" Montana,

I understand the study. You are not aware of the facts. Snow/Carneros schools both serve Southwest Napa.

--School Sizes:
Carneros - 225
Snow - 256
--Per Pupil Spending
Carneros - $5,048
Snow - $6,208
--Average Teacher Salary:
Carneros - $53,868
Snow - $64,730

Do you know what the saving would be to closed Snow as opposed to Carneros? I don’t. My bet is you don’t either. The School Board claims they don’t know either. Hum, sounds like they didn’t investigate that one, or they are willfully withholding information from the public.

Meanwhile, if you visit Snow you will find there is no room for expansion for portable classrooms unless you want to cram 100 - 150 more students onto school grounds like livestock. Carneros, has ample room to expand without hindering the outside area for the students.

I find any school closures hard to swallow with the School Boards #1 interest being "Balance Diversity". The 2 other schools Browns Valley (which has 365 students only b/c 1 portable classroom, 1 teacher and 1 kindergarten class (24 students) was re-assigned from Carneros to Browns Valley right before the school year) and Snow have a student body ethnicity of 16% Hispanic for Browns Valley and 56% Hispanic for Snows, compared with 86% Hispanic at Carneros.

As for ways for the School Board to save money, how about looking into its own internal costs? Superintendant John Glaser receives a car allowance in addition to his salary. I do not get paid to drive my own car to and from work, do you? Oh and then there is choice for him to take a 1 month district paid trip to Africa every summer if he chooses. Why is this even an option? Need more examples? "

napagranny46 wrote on Nov 12, 2009 12:49 PM:

" Amen, Montana. Amen.

Some of the comments here make it sound like this is something that is only happening in Napa.

IT IS NOT.

On the news this morning I heard about teachers going on strike, schools closing, etc - all in other Bay Area districts. The people in Sacramento have royally messed it up for education all over the state.

To me, it is simple - if you want to help keep class sizes low, have local contorl of the money, not have to fire teachers, and keep schools small, vote yes on the parcel tax. I no longer have children in the schools, but it's worth $10 a month to me to make sure these things don't happen. It's because I care about kids in Napa. "

zamersmith wrote on Nov 12, 2009 1:18 PM:

" Montana,

Now I understand the need to consolidate schools that have 25 or 12 students as there are those in the district. However, living within the means of a budget for a school district does not mean closing larger schools and increasing class sizes.

Under current CA Law to receive full funding from the state your class sizes needs to be at a ratio of 20:1. For every student above the 20:1 ratio means the State demands you pay a portion of those funds back to the State at the formula the State has set. This school years ratio is 24:1, NVUSD isn’t receiving full funding for the students from the state. Next year the ration will be 28:1, if the school board approves their master plan, resulting in even less money from the state. (Now I do not agree with States in this regard. However, this is a different topic all to its own.)

So NVUSD deciding to give money back to CA; how, does that help anyone (students, teachers, administrators or residents)? The school board has within its means to receive full funding from the State, if it chooses to go down that path.

Your logic on Social Services is extremely flawed. I am sure on some instances of Social Services we would agree, however, by your analogy you shouldn’t have to pay for the Fire Department to respond to your house fire when you call 911 b/c you have never had to use it before. I can only imagine your conversation:

911: Your house is on fire? Can we please have a credit card number, and once payment has been approved we will send out a truck to put out your fire, and rescue any trapped victims? "

zamersmith wrote on Nov 12, 2009 1:32 PM:

" napagranny46

I agree with you and montana, that this is happenning everywhere, and the issue did not just show up over night. The problems our children and schools face is from years, if not decades for neglect, greedy and lack of planning by the people WE elected.

Let's not forget these people are ELECTED officials, and are receive salaries from the tax payers. These people are not full time employees, Vice President Robb Felder is employeed at a local winery. President Thomas Kensok no longer has children in the school district.

This board is in charge of making decision, and assign people to committees for them to review and vote on recommendations. I beleive a group of volunteers representing administrator, teachers, parents and students used on a rotational basis can address the challenges this district faces with the information the current board has just as well as the current board members. At least the group I suggested has an actual vested interested in the schools instead of politcal and monetary personal gains.

Just another creative way to help save the district the same amount of money annually as closing a larger school would. "

zamersmith wrote on Nov 12, 2009 1:35 PM:

" Montana, I apology as I put in the incorrect name in my post regarding Social Services, it should have be directed towards nappalachia. "

montana wrote on Nov 12, 2009 1:42 PM:

" Zamers,

Are you seriously arguing that it is not more expensive to run a small school than a large one? Can you not see the savings with the elimination of a principal, a secretary, aids, librarians, and custodians? Can you not see the savings in utility costs?

There is one major reason your “why Carneros, why not somewhere else” cry doesn’t pan out. The majority of the kids that attend Carneros DO NOT live anywhere near there. They are bussed in. Why close a school that actually has a neighborhood population to save one that doesn’t?

I certainly can’t speak for the school board, but I have a sneaking suspicion that their #1 interest is staying financially sound. Or I sure hope it is. What is best for kids’ only counts if you can pay the bills and stay afloat. You don’t need to look farther than Vallejo Unified to see that.

As for the superintendant and his car allowance; I can speak from experience that it is much cheaper to pay a car allowance than to pay the IRS’s per mile rate for employees who drive around as part of their job. That is just good business.

Oh, and if you if you really believe the school district offers the superintendant an annual one month African vacation, I have a bridge to sell you. That is hilarious, I am roaring will laughter (get it….roaring…I crack myself up :). "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 12, 2009 1:57 PM:

" To all who support the parcel tax.
I support public funding of schools.
I expect good opportunities to be given to our students.
I expect the NVUSD and all it's employees to fulfill their job description in an efficient and effective manner.
I do NOT think we are getting the results we are paying for.
I do NOT support putting any extra money into the system UNTIL we fix it.
So how do we find common ground?
We both want the Napa students to succeed.
We are both willing to continue paying EXISTING taxes for the schools.
We both want to hold the NVUSD accountable for their actions and results.
If we focus, no matter the outcome of this parcel tax poll on holding the NVUSD accountable and pushing them to make reasonable, fiscally sound decisions, that improve our students outcome we can begin to change the system together.
Any attempt to demonize someone (or suggest they don't care about our students) just because they do not want to pay ADDITIONAL taxes, will not foster support of (or improve) the NVUSD.
Please remember that the taxes we pay for the schools has not decreased.
We are currently paying for 4 school bonds.
Just because you are willing (and able) to pay more does not mean others are.
Many of those others are just as committed to improving the NVUSD, they just may not be willing (or able) to pay additional taxes to do so.
Do not diminish the contribution EVERY taxpayer is currently making to the NVUSD.
If the NVUSD had accomplished it's mission of teaching our students efficiently and effectively, I certainly might support additional taxes, but since the root cause of the issue is their inability to DO THEIR JOB, I refuse to pay MORE. "

pat wrote on Nov 12, 2009 2:39 PM:

" Zamersmith,

I agree with you that closing Carneros would be a shame, but I also see the reasoning behind it. I am glad I don’t have to make that decision!

For clarification: Education code allows for K-3 class sizes to be 30:1. The class size reduction that changed that ratio to 20:1 clearly costs a school district a substantial amount of money. When enacted, many teachers were hired and classrooms added to school sites. Because of the huge expense, the State offered some funding to offset some of the costs. When the NVUSD went to 24:1 this last year, it came with a significant savings to the district (over a million dollars). So, to say the district is giving money back to the state is not correct, they are in fact, saving money.

One other thing I thought I would point out is that the School Board does not receive salaries from NVUSD, nor are they employees of the school district. We elect them to represent us, and from what I see, spend a lot of time doing so.

Good luck with Carneros! "

montana wrote on Nov 12, 2009 2:50 PM:

" Zamer,

You suggested a group of volunteers representing administrator, teachers, parents and students to review matters like this. They do. A few years back, a Facilities Task Force made up of a couple dozen citizens and some district folks did exactly that. Know what the outcome was? The task force recommended closing Carneros. It was the school board you are slamming that saved it. In my opinion, they made the mistake back then of not listening to the citizens (tax payers) and should have closed then. Maybe it’s not too late. "

pat wrote on Nov 12, 2009 3:12 PM:

" Notanapan,

You clearly believe that NVUSD is at fault for all that has gone wrong in public education. You claim to be “committed to improving the NVUSD”. Let me ask you this: How?

How are you committed to improving the NVUSD? Do you go to school board meetings? Have you attended any of the many, many budget meetings that have occurred over the last year? Have you joined any committee, task force, or advocate group to better understand the challenges that come with educating our youth? You say you want accountability, you say you want better results, again are you helping our kids get any of this?

I commend you on your passionate plea to not spend what would be about $10 a month to give our kids a better education; it certainly is your right. But in your plea you either don’t understand the current bonds and taxes or are intentionally misrepresenting them. While your tax rate has not decreased, the funding of our schools has been slashed. NVUSD has had its budget cut every year for years now. While there are 4 school bonds on your property tax bill, only three have anything to do with NVUSD. And those three, are for building and facility improvements, as approved by the voters. These can not be used for teachers, class sizes, or supplies. This $10 a month would be. Is that really too much to ask? "

zamersmith wrote on Nov 12, 2009 3:36 PM:

" Pat,

Please review you fact about K - 3 classes size regarding receiving CSR funds from the state, and the class ratio for those funds: here is the link the CA CDE FAq's

http://www.cde.ca.gov/ls/cs/k3/csrfaq.asp

You will note it states for full funding your class room ratio must be 20.44:1

Secondly, I'd appreciate you quoting me like you called out others quoting you earlier in your posts. I stated the salaries of the Board Members were paid for by tax payers. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 12, 2009 3:38 PM:

" Pat,

You are right, I have not been involved in this subject until recently, due to the fact that until recently I did not live here (hence the "notanapanative" moniker.

Now that I am living here I am certainly going to look very closely at every expenditure I am asked to make on behalf of any organization or cause.

I am committed to improving the schools through the efficient and effective use of funding already provided.

Wasteful and ineffective spending through mismanagement is not acceptable.

I have asked numerous times when the last teacher who had tenure or was considered "permanent" was let go for poor performance?

So far NO ONE HAS ANSWERED!

Why?

Because the answer is ZERO!

As long as we allow administrators,teachers and others who are doing a poor job (and there are some in the NVUSD) to continue to teach our students and manage our schools/resources, we are shortchanging our students and ourselves.

Not every problem needs more money thrown at it.

Not everything can be fixed with an extra tax.

Sometimes you have to work SMARTER.

I am committed to getting better results out of our school system through better management, not by dumping another 6 truckloads of cash onto the doorstep of the NVUSD.

Being asked to do things better is a normal part of every private sector job. Why should the school system be any different?

In fact the requirements should be higher because they are teaching our children, not dealing with a good or service.

But the entire system has failed miserably year after year, as evidenced by the pathetic competency results.

Why was this allowed to continue for this long? "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 12, 2009 3:55 PM:

" Pat,

I am very aware that the bonds were for capital(construction) projects.

It is immensely irresponsible to build a project and not have the funds to run it.

I seem to recall a pool with no lifeguard.

If the problems in the NVUSD were just caused by this recent budget shortfall, I would be much more willing to support the NVUSD , however it is clear (based on competency rate published on the NVUSD website) that they have been failing to teach our children for years.

Given that this is a chronic problem, we need to make a drastic change to the system before I (and many others based on the poll results) are willing to contribute EVEN MORE.

Remember, I am not advocating to reduce the amount I am paying, just to keep it the same in the face of a very poor performance by the NVUSD.

It is incumbent on the NVUSD to convince me through competent management and acceptable results that they deserve MORE of MY money.

They certainly haven't done so to this point.

You ask is $10 per month to much to ask for education, the answer is no if it were only $10 per month.

I am willing to pay much more than that for good education.

Unfortunately for your argument we are already paying MUCH MUCH MORE than that.

Please feel free to donate any additional amount you feel appropriate, please also don't be surprised when others say no, when you try to force them to do the same.

Personally I will take that $10 a month and contribute it to another local children's charity that I know is far more effectively and efficiently spending my money. "

Kizzie wrote on Nov 12, 2009 4:25 PM:

" Where is the Hell NO button? "

zamersmith wrote on Nov 12, 2009 4:28 PM:

" Napa Residents,

Please review my posts for what they are. One parent concerned about the overall performance of the District and School Board in relationship to the needs that are provided and yet to be provided.

My primary objection, to the School Board in particular, is when questioned they cannot or will not respond. We deserve more and should expect more from elected officials. I am sorry I am human, and have an issue going along with the status quo just for the sake of saying I did.

Questions need to be asked, our elected officials need to be held accountable for their plans and implementations. We all have a voice, and shouldn’t allow the narrow-minded to force you down the path they feel is best. We are not sheep.
Raising tax and closing schools aren’t the only options available to them; however, their focus lies here. All I am asking for is open-minded solutions to help all schools, like outfitting schools with solar, to reduce the operating cost of schools district wide. For nay-sayers, there are federal grants specifically for public schools to acquire and install this equipment for zero out of pocket expense. This is a district wide problem. The burden to resolve it should be district wide, not just focusing on savings from close one school here and there.

So if the voters decide not to pass the Parcel Tax, all those who voted yes can say I did my part by voting yes and can sleep with a clear conscience b/c they figured throwing money at the problem would make it go away. Instead, they should be blaming the School Board for not having an alternative plan in place, and ultimately it will be the Children of Napa’s problem. "

pat wrote on Nov 12, 2009 4:30 PM:

" Zamersmith,

I think you misunderstood me, school board members do not receive a salary – not from NVUSD or the tax payers as you state. I assume that is why they have day jobs.

Notanapan,

I think we should just agree to disagree. I am happy to hear you have a commitment to improving the schools. May I suggest you do so by getting involved with the school district or work in a classroom, I think you will be pleasantly surprised at all the extremely hard working and competent people you meet. You seem to have a strong impression of the school system for being new here. Not sure exactly where that all comes from. But, might I suggest that you go to a school board meeting or watch it on T.V. Pay special attention to when they report out of closed session. That is were they take action on employees – and yes, they do let teachers go. "

limodriver2 wrote on Nov 12, 2009 6:05 PM:

" Any of you people complaining ever called or emailed a school board member? The few times I have needed to, they were always very responsive and happy to answer my questions. Maybe that should be the first step rather than asking questions here?

But that would require a minumal amount of effort, right? "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 12, 2009 6:08 PM:

" Pat,

Yes I think that is the best course of action, we will agree to disagree.

Although I am new here (just over a year), it does not take long to assess the NVUSD proficiency reports, look at the number of school bonds, level of property taxes, NVUSD salary reporting to determine the system is broken.

I would also like you to direct me to (as I have been unable to find it) the data on how many tenured or "permanent" employees have been terminated for under performing.

I fully acknowledge that a great many untenured positions are eliminated yearly, it is the tenured or permanent positions I am inquiring about.

I also will begin attending the school board meetings and asking questions.

I will be easy to identify as I am very willing to ask pointed questions, and do like to debate.

I will also vote NO, as I am fairly certain that despite the non scientific poll used here, the NVUSD will generate a "push poll" and get the results they want and will put this parcel tax on the ballot.

You see I understand human nature and the powers that be find it so much more palatable to say they need more money, rather than to admit they are human, have made mistakes and have wasted our taxpayer money, and harmed our students with their mismanagement of OUR schools. "

nappalachia wrote on Nov 13, 2009 7:06 AM:

" Montana, I agree with you 100% on incarcerated paying their way.

So why not apply your logic to healthcare? "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 13, 2009 7:28 AM:

" Limodriver2,

It is the NVUSD that is responsible for convincing the Napa taxpayer to part with MORE of it's money than it already does, if it wants more.

You can rest assured that there will be many more questions etc., from the folks who have been engaged during this debate/discussion.

In regards to your "minumal amount of effort, right?" comment, based on the results from the NVUSD, that is exactly what the Napa Taxpayer has received from the NVUSD.

The proficiency scores for the District (all High Schools combined as per the NVUSD website) are as follows : English and Science 50% of students are proficient, Math 44% proficient, History/Social Sciences 38% proficient.

Exactly how do you justify continuing on with the group of folks that got us these results?

How many years of "minumal amount of effort, right?" does it take to get this kind of result?

Remember these results are based on the easier state standard and not the harder Federal standard.

These results are OUTRAGEOUS and UNACCEPTABLE!

Time to change the system! "

noblindershere wrote on Nov 13, 2009 7:46 AM:

" Pat- I'm in the classroom, very involved in district talks and I have not been impressed with some of the teachers and especially not the leadership.I happen to be in the classroom at a good performing school as well. I'm looking forward to when several of our downtown leaders reach retirement. Not confident at all in their ability to lead our students into the 21st Century. Too many people have been promoted within the ranks and it has not served our district well. The small town "girls" network in the district office has got to go. When the head of HR and the head of our union are very close I question the leadership. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 13, 2009 9:36 AM:

" noblindershere,

Are you serious? The HR head and the Union head are friends or "very close"?

Has the NVUSD ever heard of "professional distance" in relationships?

What about a "conflict of interest"

Anyway I will leave it there before I say anything that causes my outrage (if this is actually true), to say something that gets my comment banned. "

whoa cowboy wrote on Nov 13, 2009 10:57 AM:

" Sure I'd be happy to pay as long as I get a choice in my child's education. Give me school vouchers so I can pick the best education for my kids. "

noblindershere wrote on Nov 13, 2009 11:54 AM:

" notanapanative- its takes someone from outside the area to realize that the relationship is odd, yes, it is a conlfict of interest in the highest order. %This is just one example of the unprofessionalism going down at the downtown office. A big shake up needs to happen, hopefully some will retire soon. OUtrage, you have no idea, the list is long.... "

alucawanza wrote on Nov 13, 2009 5:50 PM:

" Just what I love to read. More teacher bashing.
notanapanative:
*Please go to the Napa Valley Educators' Association website and read the contract with the district.
*You didn't ask me about teachers being dismissed. I know of three. They were permanent but didn't do well on evaluations, were asked to make certain changes and did not. More information is not appropriate for me to discuss.
*Learn about each school's population, socio-economic levels, English learner populations.
*Visit some schools and get to know about them. A year in this town and reading test scores does not give you a complete picture of the programs in place. You are criticizing and making blanket statements with little research. I know you've read the scores, dont tell me again...
*The Union's negotiating team and H,.R. meet twice a month. Of course they know each other. The director of H.R. used to be a teacher. The meetings are conducted under the philosophy and directions of a system called Interest Based Problem Solving,. It is not an adversarial situation. It is based on consensus and agreement on priority of interests.
*Using the terms outrageous and unacceptable is really antagonistic, especially from a virtual "outsider." Better tone down your vitriol before visiting our professional educators. You won't find a better staff in the NVUSD in any other district. Perhaps looking for information should be your goal.
In the meantime go to:
http://rondagp.wordpress.com//2009/05/14/86/

I find your posts offensive. "

alucawanza wrote on Nov 13, 2009 6:02 PM:

" Sorry notanapanative
I responded on the parcel tax site not the blog about salaries...
Sure a lot of space taken up to beat up teachers...Someone has issues. Perhaps a tough sixth grade teacher made you show your work in Math, proofread your English essays, answer comprehension questions in complete sentences, and play fair on the playground. "

alucawanza wrote on Nov 13, 2009 6:40 PM:

" whoa cowboy
Vouchers:
* Do not mean you can choose any school. If it's full...
* Do not mean that the amount of the voucher will pay the full tuition to any private school.
*Do not mean a private school has to accept your child. If he/she has a behavior or learning problem he/she will not be welcome. Or..willl be asked to leave if not a satisfactory performer.
*Will create a bureaucracy that will have to be paid for out of what funds do you think? Who will send out the vouchers? Who will validate and do the bookkeeping? Which central office will keep the records?
*Will create a problem of separation of church and state. My taxes cannot pay for religious education. It's unconstitutional..
*Do not mean that private schools will test your child using the same standards that California public schools are required to teach.
*Do not mean that the curriculum taught at a private school will be grade level appropriate. They don't have to teach the standards that are mandated for public schools.
*Do not mean that your child will be taught by a credentialed teacher in a private school. Requirements are lax here.
Good luck with that voucher idea.
How about home teaching?? Now there's an idea! "

alucawanza wrote on Nov 13, 2009 10:24 PM:

" notanapanative
Sorrry about the typo. The sentence should read: You won't find a better staff than the NVUSD in any other district. And that's the truth! I worked with them for twenty-five years. I was a union negotiator. Had many a cup of coffee with HR. Followed the contract to the letter and encouraged all to do so. Read the contract.
You want test scores to go up? There are many ways for this to happen. It rests with students and parents. They have to buy into the idea that education is important. They mustn't just mark anything for an answer on the test but actually read the question. They must become responsible for doing their classwork as well as homework. Students must take ownership of their learning. Parents must partner with teachers. You will find that the schools with the highest scores have the highest rate of parent participation. The teachers are doing an excellent job. They are highly skilled, dedicated, and value the performance and learning of each student. It's the old saying, "You can lead a horse to water... "

glenroy wrote on Nov 14, 2009 12:17 PM:

" whoa cowboy....you just touched the 'live-wire'....

Nothing is worse the vouchers when the CTA is concerned....I mean nothing... "

noblindershere wrote on Nov 14, 2009 1:20 PM:

" alucawanza- I respect that you were a teacher for many years, a very hard job. BUT, to state that we have the best teachers around , when you taught in the same district for years, is pushing it. How do you know we have the best teachers around? What are you comparing them to, were you not in your classroom everyday, unable to go out and check what other districts have? I never have the opportunity to go and see what my peers are doing in their classrooms, so I would never say we have the best teachers around, because I have no personal experince to base it on. I always hate when I hear my principal, say, oh "she is such a great teacher", I think to myself, when was the last time you were in my class to make that statement? To make such statements you need to be able to back them up and unless you have been in all the teachers classrooms you can not state that they are "great teachers". I have witnessed some very unprofessional actions from peers on my campus and in no such way would I ever state that we have the best teachers, a great number of our teachers got jobs because they knew someone...not good. Kind of like the donwtown office,people getting promoted because they have been in that office for years and not because they were the best candidate. Serious overhall needs to happen...clean house "

So It Goes wrote on Nov 14, 2009 5:38 PM:

" I can't wait for my call from the poll takers.
Pick me!
Pick me!

When is this poll supposed to start?
Anybody out there get a call yet?

Come On Call me...Call me...Call me... "

calfan wrote on Nov 14, 2009 7:44 PM:

" noblindershere, are you a teacher? You certainly seem to be claiming to be one in your post today, yet you have never said that before. I am confused.

At my child's school, the principal is routinely in the classroom doing teacher evaluations. So that's how she would know how the teacher is doing - by watching them.

And your question of how alucawanza would know if his/her peers were doing a good or bad job can be turned right back around on you. If you question that alu knows teachers are doing a good job, how can you turn around and say the ones you know are doing a bad job? Do you see them? Aren't you in the class teaching? "

alucawanza wrote on Nov 15, 2009 3:41 PM:

" noblindershere
When you teach for 25 years you see a lot of teaching. I was also the teacher- in- charge for 14 years and took the place of the principal when she was gone. Every year I participated in staff development at the school and district level. I piloted new Language Arts series and new Math programs meeting with teachers from around the district in curriculum meetings. I trained to become an evaluator for Program Quality Reviews at other schools. I visited schools in district and out to review their programs and school plans. That's about all I'm going to say. I don't want to bore everyone with my vitae. A lot happens in 25 years. I have great respect for the NVUSD and the teachers employed there.
So you've witnessed unprofessional action. What are you doing about it? Teachers must police their own profession. Unprofessional behavior was never tolerated at the schools where I taught (4). Peer pressure and strong principals take care of this. Stand up and do something if something needs taking care of.
I didn't get hired because I knew someone. Sometimes teachers who want to transfer into a school are accepted because they have a good, well-known reputation. If you are a teacher in the NVUSD who did you know?

Thank you cal-fan. Your post asks very astute questions. Your school must have one of those "strong" principals. "

noblindershere wrote on Nov 15, 2009 4:08 PM:

" calfan- I'm a teacher, but currently in the field of education in a different manner and I'm also in my child's classroom and see the "not so good" teachers in action.So, I have seen the good, the bad and the ugly first hand. I was also an evaluator and saw firsthand bad teaching practices.
Teacher evaluations happen once a year and sometimes not every year. Principals in the classroom regularly, not at all schools.There were some years when I never had an administrator in my class the whole year unless it was to pull a student out for disciplinary reasons. "

So It Goes wrote on Nov 15, 2009 4:28 PM:

" Calfan,
If you read "noblindershere's" posting, they said,
"To make such statements you need to be able to back them up and unless you have been in all the teachers classrooms..."

Obviously this person works at one of the many schools in our district where the principals do not, for whatever reason, evaluate all of their teachers on a regular basis.

Secondly, I think "noblindershere" limited their personal observations to their campus,
"...some very unprofessional actions from peers on my campus and in no such way would I ever state that we have the best teachers..."

Alucawanza appeared to imply global knowledge of all NVUSD's teachers abilities; present and past,
"we have the best teachers around."

We do have some of the "best" teachers, but also some of the "not so great to really bad" teachers and substitute teachers.

Regarding evaluations of employees:
We have some severe deficits in regular or ANY evaluations of many NVUSD employees: teachers, Maintenance employees, principals, and support staff (district/outside agency).

Some employees haven't been evaluated in over ten years!

That is a failing of our Human Resources Department who apparently have to notify supervisors that "it is now time" for them to evaluate an employee.
If Human Resources doesn't notify the supervisor, no one has to evaluate the employee.
So,
No Evaluation generally means a Good Evaluation in our district.

Do you see any problem with this?
I do.
Here is one BIG hole in our school system that needs to be addressed.

I see many district employees who might benefit greatly from a regular evaluation of their performance effort, or lack of efforts.

Is evaluating employees every other year too much to ask? "

noblindershere wrote on Nov 15, 2009 5:07 PM:

" alucawanza- I have a good feeling I know who you are and you are right, you speak from expereince, but this is not true in all cases. Many principals say, "oh she is great" without even knowing really what they are talking about. I have expereinced really weak principals and currently see one in action at my child's school. Just because teachers have experience doesn't mean they are the best, I know several young, bright and energetic teachers that got laid off last year. While some that should retire are holding on for just one more year, really their time has come.
What am I doing about the unprofessional behavior? Well, I can bring it to the attention of the person in charge, but what does that mean. I'll tell what you it means at the school I'm at, you will be hated by all the teachers and they will make you feel very uncomfortable if it leaks out who the rat was. Peer pressure can also work in favor of those that don't want change, because change might mean their way of doing things isn't the best. I'm so tired of hearing, "well, this is how we have done it here for years", does that mean its right? Teachers telling parents to take their kids out of so and so's class because she is new to that grade and doesn't know what she is doing, even though she has taught for years, but new to the campus is just one example of unprofessionalism. If you're not in the "in crowd" at some campses it can be very hard to stay. "

noblindershere wrote on Nov 15, 2009 5:10 PM:

" so it goes- you can do self-evaluation too, what a joke! "

alucawanza wrote on Nov 15, 2009 7:48 PM:

" Teacher Evaluation
The state code states that all permanent teachers (tenured) are to be evaluated every other year unless they have shown that they need to be evaluated every year as objectives have been set for improvement.
Probationary and temporary teachers are evaluated every year.
The principal meets with the teacher at the beginning of the year and they set objectives to be met in the evaluation. The principal observes the teacher six times: three are by appointment and three are unscheduled. At the end of the year an evaluation is given to the teacher written by the principal that delineates the quality of teaching that took place to meet the objectives. Both sign. A copy goes into the teacher's permanent personnel folder.

noblindershere: Self-evaluation should be done on a daily basis. It's not a joke. It is also not part of the evaluation process mandated by the state. If a principal is doing this she/he is out of compliance.
Your school lacks leadership. Someone needs to be working on team building. there needs to be a leadership team, and interest based problem solving should be introduced to your faculty. You're right. The examples of teacher behavior you have given me are signs of unprofessionalism. Be a hero. Do you care if you're thought of as a rat? Someone has to report the elephant in the room. Perhaps it must go beyond the principal.
Who's to say that it's the older teachers' time to go? Good teachers are good through their entire career. We don't wear out like an old sweater.
I doubt you know me. "

noblindershere wrote on Nov 15, 2009 9:11 PM:

" alucawanza- I completed self-evaluations a number of times and no one came into my room. But, remember, my principal told everyone I was a "great teacher", how would he/she have known, they never came in my class. Both of these people I'm refering to are principals in the NVUSD and both are unprofessional in so many ways, but there load was too heavy, so self-evaluation became the answers to their heavy load. I set my own objectives and often a signature was given with a quick glance. I know that I was doing a good job in my class, but it bothered me that no one wanted to take time out to see what I was doing that was so great. Good teachers self-evaluate, bad ones don't and this is why it is "a joke".

You are right, good teachers are good to the end,but those that are not good at all should retire early and find another profession. Some people are just cut out to be teachers and some fell into the job by chance.

I know you, you gave it away with your long list of "hats" you wore. Its a small district "

calfan wrote on Nov 15, 2009 9:48 PM:

" Alucawanza, I appreciate your posts and all the valuable information that you bring to this discussion.

I have been reading these blogs for months, and I am sorry to see the anti-education slant that many of the posters here seem to embrace.

I think that in this thread in particular, some people are being disingenuous about who they are to attempt to prove a point. It is sad to see this person go this direction, but that's the nature of anonymous blogs. It's too bad that some will read their comments and think they are true. "

So It Goes wrote on Nov 16, 2009 7:16 AM:

" calfan,
I fail to see how "education accountability" equates to "anti-education."

But, go ahead and try to muddy the water and the focus.

Many people in Napa feel better accountability by school employees in their job performance could make a big difference in how the public might view requests for more money for employee's salaries.
It's not always about test scores.

This is not specific to only "teachers," but all those employees collecting salaries in this district.

Many district teachers and employees are also tax paying citizens and believe it or not, feel the same way as some of the what you call "anti-education" bloggers.

Plain and simple.
Not anti-education, but better accountability in management of education.
Have a great day. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 16, 2009 9:22 AM:

" Alucawanza,

Quoting one of your earlier posts"I was a union negotiator. "

By definition you are no longer an objective commentator.

You views are tainted by your receiving a financial gain from the taxpayer spending more and by the unions efforts to shield underperformance by SOME teachers.

I notice you omitted my consistent effort to include ALL NVUSD EMPLOYEES in my call for accountability, not just teachers.

I am sorry you find my posts offensive, I find the NVUSD results OFFENSIVE and UNACCEPTABLE.

I suggest you grow a thicker skin.

Everyone else is held accountable for their performance, why shouldn't the NVUSD?

The socio-economic situation in Napa is FAR BETTER than in many other places, I hardly think that in a community as wealthy as Napa, you would hide behind that.

For the record I am a English as a second Language learner, having immigrated here from abroad.

I am only asking that ALL NVUSD be held accountable for their performance.

This problem did not occur overnight, it required a extended period of mismanagement and lack of accountability to manifest into the scores that we have. "

calfan wrote on Nov 16, 2009 9:59 AM:

" So it goes, I wasn't referring to you.

I am also for accountability in education, but I do not think we should punish the children in the meantime.

You have a good day too! "

So It Goes wrote on Nov 16, 2009 1:28 PM:

" Calfan,
I am aware of who your comments were directed to.
This type of on-line discussion is a public forum for anyone in the community to weigh-in on.

In my worldveiw, this has more to do with accountability of adult employees of this school district, rather than "punishing the children" of this school district.

It's a sad response to on-going unresolved systemic problems if the arguement is:
Unless we pass yet another school tax (and this new one is for school district employee salaries) the children will be "punished."

And thank you, I am having a wonderful day. "

noblindershere wrote on Nov 16, 2009 3:44 PM:

" accountability on all fronts isnt what this district is about, more like shove it under the rug and hope it goes away.
Calfan- sorry you think my comments are disingenuous, but this is what I have experienced as an employee, community citizen and parent.

I can't wait to see the list of things the district wishes to spend money if they tax were to pass. At that time I will make my decision.

Sitting on a site council is one of the fun things I have done that helped in educating me about where dollars are spent, I hope you dig deeper in for a true assessment of this district's actions and not just from a parent's perspective, but all parties involved. "

alucawanza wrote on Nov 16, 2009 4:44 PM:

" notanapanative
You're not so objective yourself! My views are tainted because i was a union negotiator. That's a hoot. That's your objective opinion based on knowing me so well, right?
I was held accountable for my performance every other year as mandated by the state.
I don't want thick skin. I like being sensitive and empathetic. It's necessary for every teacher to have these qualities.
You need to do more research on the scores as I suggested many posts ago. "

calfan wrote on Nov 16, 2009 5:27 PM:

" noblinders, I wasn't referring to you either.

And I have been on my school's site council, as well as the PTO board. Thanks for the suggestion. "

montana wrote on Nov 17, 2009 10:08 AM:

" So It Goes, you said “Many people in Napa feel better accountability by school employees in their job performance could make a big difference in how the public might view requests for more money for employee's salaries.”

Okay, I’ll bite. How do you know this? Because of this “poll”?. Is that what you are basing this statement on? Is that what you want the school board to base their decision on? How many people are “many”? Is that a dozen, fifty, a hundred, two hundred? Any of these numbers is not a significant number of people (statistically) to predict ANYTHING in a district the size of NVUSD.

That is why the school board is looking to take an actual poll. One that is scientific, unbiased and can predict the outcome of the success of a measure on a ballot. People who claim the district would use a push poll simply don’t understand what a push poll is. There is absolutely no benefit to the district to use one. That is not what they are designed for. To suggest that shows a lack of the fundamental understanding of the dynamics of polls and poll taking. "

alucawanza wrote on Nov 18, 2009 3:48 PM:

" disingenuous:
dis·in·genu·ous (dis′in jen′yo̵̅o̅ əs)

adjective

1.not straightforward; not candid or frank; insincere
2.slyly deceptive or misleading, typically by means of a pretense of ignorance or unawareness "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 18, 2009 5:58 PM:

" "Objectivity:

Synonyms" Impartiality, Independence, Neutrality

Noun

Antonym : Subjectivity
Meaning : Having bias, prejudice, partisanship

nuff said? "

So It Goes wrote on Nov 18, 2009 8:18 PM:

" montana,
No need for you to "bite" at anything.
I wasn't fishing.
And have no idea why you're ranting about "push polls," but whatever gets you through the day. "

alucawanza wrote on Nov 18, 2009 11:49 PM:

" notanapanative
I've looked at your post from a different perspective. Of course I was biased, prejudiced, and partisan. My first interest was the education of children. What was the best environment for quality education? This is the bias of every teacher.
Sound disingenuous?
My second interest was to represent the interests of the teachers at my grade level. I was their voice.
I think after this explanation I am finished with my discussion with you.
I don't engage with people who say, "nuff said." It's dismissive and patronizing.
I still recommend the NVEA website for a better understanding of the relationship between teachers and the administration. I also recommend a closer inspection of test scores in this district, especially those scores of students in schools with an alternative school. You will find another issue that may be of interest. "

notanapanative wrote on Nov 20, 2009 3:39 AM:

" Alucawanza,

So now I am dismissive, patronizing and disingenuous?

Please remember , that the bias I am objecting to is, the inherent financial gain any NVUSD employee has in having the taxes that pay their salaries raised, while at the same time disavowing ANY responsibility or accountability for the school test results.

I have never suggested that the teaching of our students should not be a highly valued and rewarding career.

My objection is that there is no acceptance by any NVUSD employee or group that they have any responsibility in the performance of the school/students.

Are you aware of the protest in Boston where the union is upset that only some of it's teachers received a bonus, (the ones deemed exceptional), the union is demanding that ALL of their teachers deserve the bonus.

It is not credible to suggest that EVERY teacher in the district is exceptional.

Any group will have the great, good and poor performers in it. A vigorous and meaningful evaluation of all employees on an annual basis is what is expected in the private sector, why should the school system be any different?

Until the various groups that directly receive financial benefits from the education process, acknowledge that they are, at the very least, in a conflict of interest position when discussing these topics we will continue to disagree and oppose each other.

I will certainly investigate the NVEA website and fully expect to engage with you on other topics on the NVR site.

I fully support a vigorous two way exchange of information/opinions, and support all viewpoints to be heard, including mine.

Please continue to offer your opinion and insights. "

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