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Move the fair to Napa Pipe?
Developer Keith Rogal has discussed the idea that the Napa Town and Country Fair could occupy 19 acres on the Napa Pipe property’s 155-acre site above. Register file photo | Buy photos
Developer open to idea, says carnival and demolition derby wouldn’t work
Wednesday, June 24, 2009
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The 154-acre Napa Pipe property is not only big enough for several thousand housing units, an acre of stores, a 150-unit condo hotel and 140,000 square feet of industry, it could also accommodate the Napa Town and Country Fair.

Napa Pipe developer Keith Rogal told the fair board Tuesday of the availability of 19 acres at the 155-acre Napa Pipe site for a new fairgrounds.
The idea of moving Napa Valley Exposition to Napa Pipe has been bubbling up for years. This would free up the 32-acre downtown fairgrounds — the object of many noise and parking complaints — for private redevelopment.

Rogal’s presentation to the fair board was informational only. Fair directors weren’t actively promoting a new fairgrounds. Neither was Rogal.
“We’re here because a lot of people have been asking me over and over again ... would we be open to it,” Rogal said.

Most of the Napa Pipe site is part of a master plan proposal now undergoing environmental review by Napa County, but there are 19 acres yet to be planned, Rogal said.
This acreage is located at the south end of Napa Pipe, close to the Butler Bridge. The site would be buffered by light industrial buildings so that fair activities wouldn’t have a big impact on residents, Rogal said.

The current scope of fair activities — in particular, the carnival and the demolition derby — would likely not work at Napa Pipe, Rogal said. A fair that promoted agriculture, arts and crafts and the Junior Livestock auction would work, he said.

Rogal suggested that the fair had added a carnival with rides mostly for financial reasons. If a way could be found to run the summer fair without that revenue, or have the carnival at another location, that might work, he said.

Fair directors peppered Rogal with questions, but put off a full discussion of a fairgrounds relocation for another time.

Director Marjorie Preston said the carnival was an integral part of the summer fair and probably could not be split off.

“You need to figure what are the things really important to your mission,” Rogal said.

While thrill rides and the destruction derby seem like a poor fit, rodeos could work, Rogal said. Rodeos are “rooted in the West,” he said.

Noise-making activities could occur behind a berm, with the noise directed toward the river, away from residents, Rogal said.

Fair Director Eric Lehman asked if Rogal was proposing to make the 19 acres a gift to the state of California, which owns the current fairgrounds on Third Street and Silverado Trail.

Because the 19 acres have “considerable value,” Rogal said it would be up to the state to work out an equitable arrangement. A land swap could be considered, he said.

Director Dee Cuney worried that the fair, which is officially the 25th District Agricultural Association, would be trading one flood-prone property for another. The flood risk at Napa Pipe will be solved by elevating the property, Rogal said.

The site being talked about for a fairgrounds was proposed for light industry in the first Napa Pipe development plan. More recently, someone suggested using the property to generate solar electricity, he said.

“This is strictly an educational thing,” Expo CEO Joe Anderson said after the meeting. Fair directors aren’t likely to have a further discussion until autumn, he said.
33 comment(s)

kevin wrote on Jun 24, 2009 4:46 AM:

" Or even better, maybe we could hold the Fair at the Napa Sanitation Plant!

We could have paddle boats out on the ponds!

What would be the difference? Napa Pipe is a toxic waste dump full of asbestos, lead and PCBS.

Keep the Fair where its at now. This is just another land grab for a few people to make big bucks selling the Fair property... "

shareathought wrote on Jun 24, 2009 6:45 AM:

" Much less acreage for a much larger (county-wide, overall), population.

Rogal said:
“We’re here because a lot of people have been asking me over and over again ... would we be open to it,”

Who are all of these "people?" "

kbf wrote on Jun 24, 2009 6:57 AM:

" Boy Keith Rougal is really fishing and not in the river. Can't imagine a fair without rides and a destruction derby. He probably wants to swap the napa pipe property for the fairgrounds property with him coming out on top. I hope the fair board keeps their heads about them and says no. "

Dirty Napkin wrote on Jun 24, 2009 7:57 AM:

" NO! Lets vote on it! "

native74 wrote on Jun 24, 2009 8:23 AM:

" The flood risk at Napa Pipe will be solved by elevating the property, Rogal said.

Nice...change a natural occurring flood event to create another one where it probably doesn't occur already. Where's the mitigation for this? Is Rogal going to pay to raise my levee or create a deficit nearby that'll fix what he's changing? "

mikeb wrote on Jun 24, 2009 8:23 AM:

" If rodeo's are OK what could be wrong with carnival rides and the demolition derby? This is a very pathetic attempt to grab headlines and fuel support by creating a rumor that the fair would be moved to that location, if only the project were to be approved. When it is forced to a vote I'm still voting no. "

richards wrote on Jun 24, 2009 8:27 AM:

" So if they moved the Expo and didn't have the derby of carnival Who would want to attend? I sure know I wouldn't!

And what about the RV park and Bingo? All it would be is a once a year crafts fair with farm animals!

They would definitely get no revenue from that! And then if they did have the derby and carnival in a different location how would people enjoy both venues?

Oh My Oh My The manure pile from the animals just gets deeper in Napa every year I get older!

I know this is a new age and some things are getting out dated but come on people get "expletive" real! "

angrytoo wrote on Jun 24, 2009 8:28 AM:

" Skip all the housing and just put the fair out there. A fair with no rides or destruction derby??? Next you'll tell me I won't be able to get the free concert or greasy food. "

richards wrote on Jun 24, 2009 8:29 AM:

" It all sounds like just a plan to take over valuable and and toss the Expo!

Stupid Stupid Stupid! "

napagirl76 wrote on Jun 24, 2009 8:50 AM:

" so let me get this right, Keith wants to move the fair to Napa Pipe to help neighbors up here not have to deal with noise and traffic. yet he wants to put the fair next to his housing and he doesnt think those people well whine about noise and traffic. what about parking down there? Alot of people here in town walk to the fair and cant do that down there.
More so the carnival part of the fair is why 90% of the familes go, so kids can ride the rides you take that away and your numbers are going to drop huge. Also the Demo Derby sales out every year why take away that money maker? keep the fair where it is with the rides and derby!!! "

Piquemyinterest wrote on Jun 24, 2009 9:55 AM:

" I agree with Kevin it is a land grab and most of the developers here just want the revenue of this prime location the fair sits on now. It's all about Revenue in this town and there is no concern for the citizens of this town. It's set up for the affluent and wealthy to make the rules for all here. Shameful. Signed a Napa Citizen "

5th generation napan wrote on Jun 24, 2009 10:14 AM:

" So lets just be done with it and make napa pipe the new downtown napa and have all the events there. "

horsegirl wrote on Jun 24, 2009 10:14 AM:

" I personally being a FFA member think that this would be a bad move for the fair because all of the kids that participate in the junior live stock auction would be losing out on what some of there animals were really worth because alot of our viewers are little kids being there to ride the rides and if they take the carnival part and destruction derby and put it somewheres elts then the visiters to the animals would go way down because the parents wouldnt want to travel to a diffrent area to let there kids see the animals because it is more money being spent useing gas when the gas prices are fluctuating. so i urdge the public to vote No on this because the alot the kids that perticipate in this use the money off or there animals to go to collage. "

bennyd wrote on Jun 24, 2009 10:54 AM:

" Having the fair downtown is a wonderful treat for us as locals. We love walking to the fair and afterwards enjoying walking around downtown too. Tourists who visit, and stay here will be pleasantly surprised at the diversity of events and things to do in the downtown/Oxbow area, if they happen to visit during the fair. Moving it will only make it more obscure and distant for the growing options in downtown. "

UncleStuy wrote on Jun 24, 2009 12:02 PM:

" What is a fair without rides and demo derby ? BORING ! Why not less housing and more area for the County Fair ? You want to trade for 32 acres for 19 acres. What kinda deal is that ? What flooding ? Is that why we have that flood control project ? Bad Idea, very bad idea !!! "

NapaKid80 wrote on Jun 24, 2009 12:18 PM:

" I think everyone is jumping the gun a little bit here. No one said that the fair is moving tomorrow. I don’t even think it was Keith’s idea to move it to Napa Pipe. I have been to a few meetings about Napa Pipe and there have been a few people in the crowd that have mentioned the idea of moving it. And Keith listened to these people and is open to the idea, however if it doesn’t work and the people that run the fair don’t want it, than it won’t happen. I think everyone needs to calm down a little and enter into this with an open mind. "

random name here wrote on Jun 24, 2009 12:23 PM:

" When I think of the County Fair, memories of munching on a corn dog while strolling through the rides and boardwalk games fill my head. Something about the Carnies and all the blinking colored lights create a fair atmosphere. Without this, it would just seem like a big petting zoo with displays of jams, quilts, and vegetables. I'd also like to see something new along Silverado Trail south of Third St. "

napalove wrote on Jun 24, 2009 12:39 PM:

" Frankly I would not like to see the fair at Napa Pipe. I think it is fine where it is. Napa Pipe should be built out for the original purpose that Keith is proposing, to allow people that commute a place to live closer to where they work and help solve Napa’s housing challenges "

LittleoneTT wrote on Jun 24, 2009 12:53 PM:

" I think Keith even discussing the idea of offering 19 acres for the fair is extremely generous. Whether or not the fair belongs there or not is for the organizers to decide. Both sides have said that there are no serious discussions going on, so why is everyone getting so worked up? "

Sickothis wrote on Jun 24, 2009 2:04 PM:

" The reality is the Fair Board approached Mr. Rogal, informally. There's a ton of work that needs to be done to the fairgrounds, and obviously the State ain't gonna pay to do it, so looking for a new venue is the boards fiduciary responsibility. "

jasonjac wrote on Jun 24, 2009 2:09 PM:

" It seems like a lot of you didn’t actually read the article. Keith Rogal merely presented moving the fair as an option. No decisions have been made, and no decisions will be made for quite a while. If you have problems with the idea of moving the fair, now would be the time to contact the fair board and let them know. Rogal isn’t asking for the fair to be moved. He’s just offering. I think it’s rather generous of him to offer up valuable space on the property that he owns. "

Keith Rogal wrote on Jun 24, 2009 3:07 PM:

" A little further background. "Shareathought" wrote "who are the people who've asked about whether you would be open to considering a relocation of the Fair to Napa Pipe?" To be more specific, I have been asked that question, repeatedly, over the past several years, by the Mayor of the City of Napa, by City staff members, by City Council Members, by Alta Heights residents, by Fair Board members, and by persons very active in the Junior Livestock Auction. And in response, I have consistently said "IF that is something that is of real interest to the Board, AND to the City Council, AND to the affected community at-large then we would seriously investigate its feasibility."

Our site is large and our plan has many public amenities, including as proposed, nearly 40 acres of privately-funded, publicly-accessible parks and open space. Conceivably, Agricultural District Fair uses could be integrated as well. But to be clear: this idea is not something I am pushing, pitching, advocating, endorsing, recommending or wishing for. My appearance at the Fair Board yesterday was at the Fair's request, and was consistent with the commitment I've made to listen to any and all ideas for how the Napa Pipe property can best be used. In that vein, many of the responses here, as always, are useful and informative. "

vinovalleygirl wrote on Jun 24, 2009 3:57 PM:

" not that this matters to the topic of this article, but I haven't gone to the napa fair in a few years now because it is always the same things year after year. i won't go at night because there seems to be more gang fights. I do however go to the Sonoma Cty fair in SR for the horse races and the flower exhibit... So maybe they should think about something like that to add to the fair... Napa Fair has become a ghost town to many locals I know. So sad too because it was a wonderful memory for me growing up. "

Paddy wrote on Jun 24, 2009 11:16 PM:

" This is a tragedy in the making..."The 154-acre Napa Pipe property is not only big enough for several thousand housing units, an acre of stores, a 150-unit condo hotel and 140,000 square feet of industry, it could also accommodate the Napa Town and Country Fair."

How many thousands of additional units will they then build at the 32 acre Fair Grounds? Where did these people come from? Can you imagine 10,000 more people living between Silverado Trail and Soscol along Third Street? "

Paddy wrote on Jun 25, 2009 7:52 AM:

" Do not move the fair from the city (it's the Napa Town and Country Fair; it's not the County Fair). It's exactly where it belongs on the 32 acres allocated for its use and enjoyment by generations of Napans.

This 19 acre for 32 acre swap is only in the best interest of the developers. The measly allocation will last for a few years only. Once the switch is made the new residents of Napa Pipe will complain vociferously about the noise and traffic (oh my gosh, the traffic!)

Let’s squash this concept immediately and permanently. "

manxkat wrote on Jun 27, 2009 8:55 PM:

" They have all this room for frivolity like the fair but Mr. Rogal continues to ignore the schools needed. Guess the sheeple of Napa will pay again like we did for AmCan high school. "

5th generation napan wrote on Jun 29, 2009 3:29 PM:

" Don't move it. Its part of the whole specturm of the "downtown". Were trying to make the downtown rebuilt upon its historic roots, and to move the fair would only diminish that view of history. "

napanatheart wrote on Jun 30, 2009 9:02 AM:

" just blow up napa pipe. just blow it all up. i'm so tired of hearing about all of it. blow it up and put a nuclear testing facility there. all the river rats at the yacht club will be thrilled with the explosions- it'll be july 4th everyday! "

napanatheart wrote on Jun 30, 2009 9:15 AM:

" like i said, blow it up. maybe the blasts would reach the eyesores that are the yacht club track homes. this would create a need for massive home development and would force developers to build more homes and meet the ridiculous low cost housing quota that the state is forcing on us. would the blast reach the DMV? that would also help our problems becuase then we wouldn't be able to get drivers licenses which would mean no more drunk driving and fatal accidents around the valley! and without people driving, we would have to worry about our pathetic roads! maybe we could also blow up alston park so there would be no pit bull tracks. have i most of napa's problems?
now in following with recent city protocol, i demand a check for $300,000 for telling you all that vital info. "

napanatheart wrote on Jun 30, 2009 12:27 PM:

" that was supposed to be pitbull "attacks" "

napanatheart wrote on Jun 30, 2009 12:29 PM:

" and "have i solved all our problems" "

misfit wrote on Jun 30, 2009 6:54 PM:

" Wow napanatheart...you sound angry.
Maybe you should take something or see someone. "

ctworker wrote on Jul 1, 2009 8:27 PM:

" and maybe we could just blow up our whole city so that it could all be re-zoned as agricultural land!!! "

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