Prowler startles Napa resident | Napa Valley Register

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Prowler startles Napa resident

Monday, January 05, 2009

Comment

By CARLOS VILLATORO
Register Staff Writer

Carlos Villatoro articles

November 8th, 2009

No injuries as mysterious shot fired in American Canyon

November 7th, 2009

Pregnant woman hurt slightly in Highway 29 accident

Woman jailed after domestic violence

Fairfield woman arrested in Napa forgery case

November 4th, 2009

Former Register editor Ross Game dead at 80

A prowler may be on the loose in an east Napa neighborhood.

The Napa County Sheriff’s Department reports that a resident on the 3000 block of Vichy Avenue awoke to the sound of a man attempting to open the front door early Sunday morning. The resident startled the prowler away and called police Napa Sheriff’s Sgt. Mike Milat said.

Deputies arrived at the home and searched the area, but didn’t locate find anyone Milat said. The prowler is described as a white male adult, 5 feet 7 inches to 6 feet tall, in his 30s, with a medium build, and wearing light-colored clothing. Anyone who has information about this individual is asked to contact the Sheriff’s Department at 253-4501. The Sheriff’s Department recommends locking doors and window to prevent burglars from entering, and calling 911 should you encounter anyone attempting to break in.

65 comment(s)

CaliGrown707 wrote on Jan 5, 2009 12:20 AM:

" wow! i know who it was! that matches the description of almost ever male in his 30's that i know! in fact, it describes the majority of 30-something's!......good luck with this one......we'll never know who this one is...... "

opiniagirl wrote on Jan 5, 2009 7:25 AM:

" If someone "gets in" my house; well lets just say that we will need the coroner to accompany those 911 responders.

Also the DIRECT number for Napa Emergency is 253-0911.

If you call 911 then you are dropped into the Santa Rosa call center, sometimes put on hold or your call not quickly answered. Cut out the middle man and call Napa 911 directly for an instant response! "

GregN. wrote on Jan 5, 2009 7:50 AM:

" This exact thing happened to me a couple years ago. The man attempted to open my door while my wife was clearly sitting on the couch in my living room. Luckily my dog was wide awake and scared him off.

When I called the police, they just passed it off, and didn't ven come to take a police report. Hopefully the man who visited me, and the man described above are locked up sooner or later. "

Dwayne wrote on Jan 5, 2009 7:58 AM:

" Arm yourself, and learn how to use the weapon... "

anticommie wrote on Jan 5, 2009 7:58 AM:

" right on opiniagirl!!! Right on!!! "

mofosheee wrote on Jan 5, 2009 9:26 AM:

" I'm with Dwayne..........

I'll shoot first, and answer questions later (thru my attorney of course) "

shgirl wrote on Jan 5, 2009 9:27 AM:

" thank you opiniagirl! "

npma wrote on Jan 5, 2009 10:07 AM:

" Just make sure the person is actually in your house. "

birddog wrote on Jan 5, 2009 10:28 AM:

" Hi
The Napa Pistol and Rifle Club offer a hand gun class for woman. The class runs for 3 day Weds, through friday from 7:00 pm until 9:00
The cost is $ 10.00 by the end you will be able to take a test the will allow you to buy a hand gun. Its a great class "

my name here wrote on Jan 5, 2009 10:44 AM:

" Come on in, prowler. There's a fire in the fireplace, cold beer in the fridge, a pizza on the table, and a game on TV. Mr. Smith, Mr. Wesson, and myself are waiting for you. "

crusher09 wrote on Jan 5, 2009 12:01 PM:

" opiniagirl you dont have the right number cause I had the same number and called it when I had a knife pulled on me it went to some female.
so the number isnt right one bit cause call it and find out.
opiniamgirl wrote"Also the DIRECT number for Napa Emergency is 253-0911. "
Ends that I found out someone called 911 and they got Napa Sheriff out and he told me in the same words that I'll right in my comment "You can call 911 and you'll get Napa dispatch."

so if you think that I'm wrong idc cause I know different. "

opiniagirl wrote on Jan 5, 2009 12:56 PM:

" Crusher - whatever floats your boat! I would encourage people to give the number 253-0911 a call and check it out, I did and I have since used the number several times. After a 911 call left me in the call drop for several minutes before they even asked for my emergency, if it had been a critical emergency then precious minutes would have been lost. I just say better safe than sorry. When those women were murdered the 911 caller (roomate) was on hold for almost 20 minutes before anyone could dispatch Napa emergency...who knows, a life could have been saved that night. "

opiniagirl wrote on Jan 5, 2009 12:58 PM:

" Also curios crusher - is 09 the year you will be graduating Vintage High as your name eludes? Nice to see youth involved in local interests! "

notshocked wrote on Jan 5, 2009 12:59 PM:

" NVR Moderator: Now that you've published conflicting information from opiniagirl and crusher09, I think you are obliged to find the right info and follow up within this posting.

This is not a random opinion of someone, a policy, a political stand, etc... it could be a life and death need and while we all know the gospel of 911... one commentor had implied it won't work. What's the truth here? We don't want everyone and their neighbor 'testing' the system! "

bloodagar wrote on Jan 5, 2009 1:10 PM:

" crusher09, if you need to get a hold of 911 dispatch via cell phone the number is (707) 253-0911.
"so if you think that I'm wrong idc cause I know different"...I am sending you a psychic pacifier, I was given this number from a police officer at a community meeting and I have personally used it twice without a problem. "

DL wrote on Jan 5, 2009 1:18 PM:

" "crusher09" You can dial 911 from a landline and it will go to Napa dispatch. But not if you call from a cell phone. If you call from a cell phone, you must dial 253-0911. And don't forget to add 1-707 if you're out of town. "

opiniagirl wrote on Jan 5, 2009 1:31 PM:

" DL - thanks for the clarification. Calling 911 from a cell phone is what causes the delay and drop into another center. Our family cancelled our landline 4 years ago when we realized that we had 7 cell phones between all of us, so I forgot to mention that a landline WILL send you to Napa dispatch directly. I was wrong to include that ALL calls go to Santa Rosa. But I would call Napa directly landine or cell no matter what if I had an emergency! "

Dwayne wrote on Jan 5, 2009 2:14 PM:

" 253-0911 is no secret... It's published on the Sheriff and NPD's web sites... "

pernodboi wrote on Jan 5, 2009 3:03 PM:

" Thanks for the phone number for Napa Dispatch. I will program this into my phone.

While I have only had to call 911 once, from a cel phone - my experience was positive - the response was fast and the operators polite. But my call was routed through the Vallejo/Benecia call center - not Santa Rosa. I wonder where the cut off is?

There's a story idea for you. How has 911 service changed with increased cel phone numbers? "

proudmommy wrote on Jan 5, 2009 3:24 PM:

" i just programmed that number into my phone. good to know since i dont have a landline, only a cell. "

krusty wrote on Jan 5, 2009 3:41 PM:

" You're right, opiniagirl, but I wouldn't recommend calling the number to find out. Those people have more important things to worry about than a citizen calling in just to make sure the number works. "

Grits wrote on Jan 5, 2009 5:00 PM:

" Gun Control means holding the weapon with both hands! Having been brought up as a proper Southern belle, I was taught how to make a proper chicken salad (use white meat only!), how to host a tasteful dinner party, BBQ, etc., NOT to wear white B4 Memorial or after Labor Day, and of course, how to kill, gut, and dress a deer, skin a chicken, and fire a weapon. These lessons have served me well, and given this report and the effectiveness of the NPD (NOT!) in rounding up the creeps who blatantly prey on law abiding citizens, will continue to do so.... "

OldCynic wrote on Jan 5, 2009 5:30 PM:

" I am all for people arming themselves against intruders! BUT as I understand it, if you shoot them during the intrusion, YOU will have to prove that your life was in immediate danger to the DA's office and EVEN IF you are absolved of all wrong doing from a criminal standpoint you will still probably have to defend yourself against a wrongful death lawsuit filed by whatever dirtbag relatives who WILL be approached by some bottom feeding lawyer looking to make a buck.
I was told that bill usually comes to about $500K to defend yourself. Better make sure you have all the right info before you pull a trigger even in your own home. "

og2009 wrote on Jan 5, 2009 5:32 PM:

" "opiniagirl" Do live in south napa?????????? You sound like my sister. except you did not mention your HUSBAND, so?????????????.... The right number to have in your Cell phone is 707-257-9223. At & T, Napa phone book. I use it aLLLLLLLLLLL the time. Someone always answers and sends someone out. The longest time was 38min. If its raining and they are busy so could take longer. After 3pm, 5pm, 7, changing shiefts. 12pm-about 2pm and every half hour between the hour @ lunch. But you can just call and like I said they will send someone out............. "

Grits wrote on Jan 5, 2009 5:56 PM:

" If an intruder is trying to enter my home, you can bet your sweet bippy I will KNOW beyond a doubt that my life is in immediate danger; otherwise, why would they want to enter an occupied domicile? The bel;ef that you are in imminent danger covers the criminal aspect of it.

As for the dirtbag relatives and their dirtbag deceased - what, I should stand there in the house and risk the death of myself and my family to avoid a civil lawsuit? Don't think that would be on my mnd at the time - it's them or me right then. Bring on the lawsuit, I guess! "

db76 wrote on Jan 5, 2009 6:56 PM:

" As a kid, a drunk neighbor wandered into my house. He was just trying to get home. Now, according to many of the people who commented above, that person would have been shot and killed for that mistake. Before you kill anybody in your home, why not think about it for half a second before you get too trigger happy. Cops and Special Forces incorporate judgement into their close quarters combat training so they can distinguish the good guys from the bad guys. They just don't blindly shoot into anybody in every situation. "

OldCynic wrote on Jan 5, 2009 7:19 PM:

" Grits, I agree! It's just good to know what you are up against after you make that decision. If he sees you and runs away from you as you shoot, your life probably wasn't in danger from a California Criminal point of view. I personally agree with the Colorado Make My Day law which says you can shoot if they enter without your permission!! "

izzy wrote on Jan 5, 2009 7:41 PM:

" Just make sure they are in your house and you are in fear of your life to establish your squeeze on that trigger. A nice grouping of your shot placement is not necessary but does provide a degree of satisfaction.......Once they are down, and you are satisfied it's a good shoot, relax, take your time and call whatever number you want, take some pics with a time stamp and finish your meal, beer, snack or whatever you were doing in the bedroom!

Good to see many folks not afraid to use lethal force if it's warranted. That class of 6 hours for $10 is a bargain, jump on it and know the law! Sometimes when not to shoot is as important as when to shoot!
Keep your powder dry and carry on... "

crusher09 wrote on Jan 5, 2009 7:59 PM:

" okas everyone has picked me out of the crowed,I went among my understanding and just wanted to let everyone know,they need to at lest call the napa police, or sheriff deparment to find out more cause they'll relase info to pulbic about the change in 911.

otherwise it really just needs to drop because
1)people who act like its a BIG deal, really just dont have much free-time

also I really dont care about others "

Dwayne wrote on Jan 5, 2009 8:11 PM:

" db76, I guess you didn't see the news yesterday with a video of the Bart cops shooting a detained guy lying on his stomach, in the back... He's dead....

Now that's "training"...... "

db76 wrote on Jan 5, 2009 8:13 PM:

" The number of trigger-happy Dirty Harry wannabees on the NVR website is disturbing. I doubt anybody who has posted on this board realizes how traumatic it is to kill another human being. Ask a police police officer who has done it. There's a reason they get time off and debriefing and counseling after a shooting incident. Chances are, if you are following the law and storing your guns correctly (unloaded and locked-up), you won't much time to ready your firearm before the intruder is either a)in your home and in your face, or b) runnnig away. "

pernodboi wrote on Jan 5, 2009 8:15 PM:

" I adore Grits, both the dish and now the person. Bravo!

Of course now I have a vision of Flo (from Mel's Diner) in hoop skirts, with two hands on a large weapon, saying 'Kiss my ....." "

OldCynic wrote on Jan 5, 2009 8:37 PM:

" db76 the whole situation is aweful but sometimes all to real!...But really "Trigger happy Dirty Harry wannabes?" That's what we are for wanting to defend our families? what of the trauma of watching helplessly as a loved one is hurt or killed by an intruder would be far worse than dealing with the guilt of defending your home with lethal force. You could probably ask many people who were without a gun at the time they were assaulted "do you wish you would have had a gun AND the knowledge of how to use it?" at the time of the assault.
What do you think their answer would have been? No I will wait for the police to arrive rather than defend myself! Of the two traumas, the choice is easy! "

Mr. Feasor wrote on Jan 5, 2009 8:44 PM:

" Perhaps an interesting throw-back to California's gunslinging frontier ways, the Penal Code provides a wide berth for the use of lethal force on home-intruders, including a legal presumption that the use of force was reasonable if the intruder forcibly entered unlawfully (see, Pen. Code sections 197 - 199).

And the notion that an attorney would actually pursue a wrongful death claim on behalf of a home intruder is laughable. But if OldCynic can cite any examples, I am all ears.

But if you end up shooting your kid who snuck out at night, or any other household member who was - say - locked out after a late night of partying, you're up the creek.

So it's probably best to loudly chamber your round (or pull the hammer back if you have a revolver) and announce your presence before plugging someone with a bunch of holes.

**The above comment shall not be construed as legal advice** "

izzy wrote on Jan 5, 2009 8:46 PM:

" Well db, I can certainly speak for myself in that respect...know the law and have your gun ready.
Pretty dumb to have your gun all unloaded and locked up, might as well not even own one.
I teach people to have it ready to go, because you may only have 2-5 seconds to make a decision. But, discretion is always advised and....if you shoot w/o knowing who you are shooting, you violate the rules of gun safety which is "know your target and what's beyond."
My advice, take that Napa S.O. course and buy the largest caliber you can comfortably handle! Also, have a mindset and be prepared for multiple perps and the after incident reaction. If the guy craps on your floor after he or she is dead, that's expected. "

Dwayne wrote on Jan 5, 2009 9:06 PM:

" I know, db76.... You liberals want everyone to be unarmed, except for the bad guys, and when some nut case starts shooting we all should cower under a desk and wait to be murdered, like more than 20-athletic males in their 20's did at Virginia Tech...

Sorry pal, but me nor any member of my family will beg for our life when threatened by some scumbag.... Anyone forcibly entering my home to cause harm needs killing...

Don't let folks know that you'll give everything up without a fight, or you'll be an easy mark for some low-life perp...

Nothing to say about the highly trained trigger-happy Bart cops shooting that kid in the back...??? "

OldCynic wrote on Jan 5, 2009 9:18 PM:

" Mr. Feasor I don't believe there is anything close to a wide berth.

http://www.self-defender.net/law4.htm
California Firearms Laws

DEFINITIONS

Use of a Firearm or Other Deadly Force in Defense of Life and Body

The killing of one person by another may be justifiable when necessary to resist the attempt to commit a forcible and life-threatening crime, provided that a reasonable person in the same or similar situation would believe that (a) the person killed intended to commit a forcible and life-threatening crime; (b) there was imminent danger of such crime being accomplished; and (c) the person acted under the belief that such force was necessary to save himself or herself or another from death or a forcible and life-threatening crime. Murder, mayhem, rape, and robbery are examples of forcible and life-threatening crimes. "

OldCynic wrote on Jan 5, 2009 9:25 PM:

" California Firearms Laws

DEFINITIONS
Protecting One’s Home

A person may defend his or her home against anyone who attempts to enter in a violent manner intending violence to any person in the home. The amount of force that may be used in resisting such entry is limited to that which would appear necessary to a reasonable person in the same or similar circumstances to resist the violent entry. One is not bound to retreat, even though a retreat might safely be made. One may resist force with force, increasing it in proportion to the intruder’s persistence and violence, if the circumstances apparent to the occupant would cause a reasonable person in the same or similar situation to fear for his or her safety.
The occupant may use a firearm when resisting the intruder’s attempt to commit a forcible and life-threatening crime against anyone in the home provided that a reasonable person in the same or similar situation would believe that (a) the intruder intends to commit a forcible and life-threatening crime; (b) there is imminent danger of such crime being accomplished; and (c) the occupant acts under the belief that use of a firearm is necessary to save himself or herself or another from death or great bodily injury. Murder, mayhem, rape, and robbery are examples of forcible and life-threatening crimes. "

OldCynic wrote on Jan 5, 2009 9:26 PM:

" Part two

Any person using force intended or likely to cause death or great bodily injury within his or her residence shall be presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily injury to self, family, or a member of the household when that force is used against another person, not a member of the family or household, who unlawfully and forcibly enters or has unlawfully and forcibly entered the residence and the person using the force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry had occurred. Great bodily injury means a significant or substantial physical injury. (Penal Code § 198.5.)
NOTE: If the presumption is rebutted by contrary evidence, the occupant may be criminally liable for an unlawful assault or homicide. "

OldCynic wrote on Jan 5, 2009 9:28 PM:

" LAST AND PROBABLY MOST IMPORTANT

Limitations on the Use of Force in Self-Defense in California

The right of self-defense ceases when there is no further danger from an assailant. Thus, where a person attacked under circumstances initially justifying self-defense renders the attacker incapable of inflicting further injuries, the law of self-defense ceases and no further force may be used.
The right of self-defense is not initially available to a person who assaults another. However, if such person attempts to stop further combat and clearly informs the adversary of his or her desire for peace but the opponent nevertheless continues the fight, the right of self-defense returns and is the same as the right of any other person being assaulted. "

OldCynic wrote on Jan 5, 2009 9:36 PM:

" Mr. Feasor you are right, I can't quote any case law for for attorneys finding surviving members of the perps family. I have taken several extensive self-defense classes in Ca. and they taught us that if you pull the trigger you probably will be sued by the family. They could have been in error but I suspect they had done their homework. My only concern is that people know the possible ramifications if they use a firearm in defense of themselves and loved ones. Everyone will need to decide this for themselves and should research and give thought to the consequences before any of this happens for real! "

Mr. Feasor wrote on Jan 5, 2009 9:58 PM:

" OldCynic - I am not one to bag on (or rely on) a website published by "Lost Johnny & Self-Defense Zone, Inc." so I prefer to stick to what the Penal Code says.

I think you fail to understand the significance of your comment entitled "Part two." That is a presumption that heavily favors the home-defender. Heavily.

It is rather difficult to rebut a presumption that is accorded to you as a matter of law. Basically, the prosecutor would have to show that you had absolutely no fear for yourself or other household members, and therefore were not justified to use the requisite force.

I suppose the presumption would be rebutted if you invited someone in, had a few drinks, decided you didn't like his looks, and decided to plug him full of holes...well then you would have a problem there.

Last, the comment entitled "LAST AND PROBABLY MOST IMPORTANT" is a general statement; it does not relate to home invasions.

I hope that clarifies any issues. And I'm still waiting on the cited references to the "bottom feeding lawyer" who WILL sue a California home-defender that used lawful force against a home-invader. "

Mr. Feasor wrote on Jan 5, 2009 10:02 PM:

" OldCynic - your last post came up after my submission. I withdraw the last smart-alecky sentence in my prior comment about bottom feeder attorneys (if it posts).

Thanks for the spirited dialogue. "

jmo wrote on Jan 5, 2009 10:11 PM:

" Whoa buckeroos: Who'd a thunk that this would be such a HOTTTTT topic in Napa?????

Let's review:
Get a gun
Get training on the use of siad gun
Program in (oh heck I'm not sure) a 911 number.

Ah heck some else will finish this for me. "

Paddy wrote on Jan 5, 2009 10:24 PM:

" If a school teacher can get off after shooting a sleeping man she's living with 5 times in the back I'm quite sure there's more than enough justification for blasting a strange intruder who has forcibly entered your home.... "

og2009 wrote on Jan 5, 2009 10:25 PM:

" Hay, "Mr. Feasor, and OldCynic" You both should watch a movie called "The Felon". Just so happed, that I watched it this last weekend. Have to agree with "OldCynic" how ever you both posted some very funny comments. The main point............LOCK YOUR DOORS AND WINDOWS. Napa is not like When "OldCynic" was a youngster....shoot probably slept out in the front porch...... "

YOUNGNAP wrote on Jan 5, 2009 11:53 PM:

" A person breaking into your home does not justify the use of deadly force. The penal code also does not allow a person to defend their property with deadly force. The amount of force also has to be "reasonable". Thank the 9th circuit for that - the penal code says one thing but legal precedent is what counts.... "

cellsitegod wrote on Jan 6, 2009 6:52 AM:

" Well, at least we got a better description for a simple prowler than we got for the stabbing downtown or the last shooting! "

opiniagirl wrote on Jan 6, 2009 8:09 AM:

" " young people" can be just as deadly and unconsionable as any other criminal or predator. "young people" also commit horrific crimes.

My home is secured (locked), always, I even drive with my doors locked.

If someone broke through that initial barrier, they are not a lost drunk or there for stories, milk and cookies.

It goes without saying; be sure before you pull the trigger...but for Gods sake arm yourselves and protect your families. If you don't; you may have regrets deeper than you can imagine one day. "

opiniagirl wrote on Jan 6, 2009 8:16 AM:

" og2009: I do have a husband, but no sisters =P

Anyone in our family age 12 and up has passed the hunting exam and can handle a gun. My 12 year old son scored a 93 - higher than most of the adults he took the class with. We only have one gun that is not locked up in the big safe. Our little (loaded and ready) handgun is secured centrally in the house where my husband and I can access it in seconds. Gun safety and security are even more important than just owning one and leaving it laying around for protection. "

OldCynic wrote on Jan 6, 2009 9:31 AM:

" Mr. Feasor. Do a word search for Wrongful Death Lawsuits Self defense.
Too many stories to quote and I know a lot of them involve law enforcement.
Odds are you will be sued.

Youngnap you are right on the money. You can't use lethal force in ca. to defend your personal property from damage or theft.

og2009 I also walked up hill to school both ways......In the snow...:) I agree lock your doors.

True story from Iowa.
http://www.calt.iastate.edu/defense.html

A woman was at home with her three small children when she was attacked by two intruders. After being choked and knocked down, she managed to get to her bedroom where a gun safe was located. While again being assaulted, she managed to get the safe open, grab a gun and shoot at the intruder. The other intruder fled from the home. After determining that her children were unharmed, the woman noticed that the remaining intruder (now wounded) continued to move in her direction. She told the intruder not to move, and fired a warning shot when the intruder didn’t stop. When the intruder still did not stop, the woman shot several more times at the intruder, killing him.

The estate of the intruder sued the woman for wrongful death, and she replied that she had acted in self-defense (she has not been criminally charged in the matter) and claimed that her conduct was covered by various insurance policies that she owned. As such, she claimed that the insurance companies were required to defend her against the wrongful death action. "

izzy wrote on Jan 6, 2009 10:06 AM:

" Do your homework on the law.
Be well trained.
Keep shooting until the threat has ceased.
Never do a warning shot, that bullet has to go somewhere!
Teach your kids to "respect" and to "understand" the gun.
My kids all learned at 6 how to shoot a small .22 cal. rifle, followed at 7 with a .22 cal. handgun. They are all grown now and still shoot on a regular basis, own a variety of firearms and don't live in or near Napa!

A few people, who live in the boonies, tell me if they are threatened by lethal force, they just Shoot and Shovel!
Disclaimer: I would never officially advise that. "

anticommie wrote on Jan 6, 2009 10:30 AM:

" db76 wrote on Jan 5, 2009 8:13 PM:
Chances are, if you are following the law and storing your guns correctly (unloaded and locked-up"

Unloaded and locked up? There are laws governing loaded firearms with children in the house yes, but You could sleep with a loaded firearm ready to shoot if you wanted too.

In my opinion the laws of Cali are ludicrous in this field. I look at it if someone enters your house for theft or violence, I say: "shoot 'em." Trial lawyers and liberals are the ones that want to sue you, and take you hard earned life savings. "

izzy wrote on Jan 6, 2009 11:27 AM:

" anticommie....

It's only going to get worse as they indoctrinate the youth of this country into thinking that guns are bad and only military and police should have them! Many young police officers have been through this indoctrination process and are now on the streets of America......a "new breed" if you will, of folks who are trigger happy themselves, but are not your friend when it comes to handgun ownership!
Most of my close friends have moved out of Calif. to Oregon, Washington State. Idaho or Az. so that they may enjoy "all" their firearms w/o ludicrous restrictions! "

Epeescott wrote on Jan 6, 2009 11:40 AM:

" First: my right to be safe and secure in my home trumps the right to be alive of anyone committing a felony to enter it.

Second: If said home invader doesn't desist when I am screaming "GO AWAY! POLICE! HELP!", they certainly will desist when I respond to this obvious threat to my life with a level of force I reasonably expect to defend my life - either a 12ga 00 Buck or a .45 from a Glock, whichever is closer to hand.

Third: DB76, my guns are legally loaded and on my person whenever I am awake. You know not whereof you speak.

Fourth: Someone already said what is needed - buy a gun, train with it, know how to contact emergency services, and know the law.9 "

OldCynic wrote on Jan 6, 2009 5:49 PM:

" I do have one final thought and that is most people would be better off with several pepper sprays located around the house if you are resistant to firearms. You are more likely to use it than you would a gun and if you make a mistake, it isn't final. Anytime you can keep an attacker 10-20 feet away from you, your chances are pretty good. "

db76 wrote on Jan 6, 2009 6:19 PM:

" Epeescott: Actually, you didn't correctly read my post. I never mentioned the law about having a gun on your person. I only mentioned the law regarding storage of a firearm. As I understand it, it's OK to carry a loaded firearm in your home or your business. Personally, I think people who carry a gun in the home, in the bathroom, in the kitchen, 24hrs a day, might have "problems" that extend further than potential intruders, if you know what I mean. "

Mr. Feasor wrote on Jan 6, 2009 8:25 PM:

" Wow, who would think that this article would end up with so many posts. I'm in agreement with jmo on that point.

OldCynic - I couldn't find any instances in California within the first couple of pages of my search (but I added "California" and "home" to the word search). But regardless, I think we agree in spirit:

(a) Know how to use a gun;
(b) Think before you shoot;
(c) Lethal force should be the last resort (even in California, which has a solid statutory presumption that you were in the requisite state of mind to use this force against a home-intruder that is not a household member).

That's why I originally suggested that one loudly announce the presence of a weapon to give the intruder time to get out of Dodge...

YOUNGNAP - 9th Circuit holdings are persuasive only, a California state court is not required to follow federal appellate precedent when interpreting state law.

No pun intended, but I'm sticking to my guns here about CA's more protective statutes regarding the use of lethal force in one's home. Which is surprising, given how liberal the state is generally.

Again, thanks for the spirited dialogue! "

OldCynic wrote on Jan 6, 2009 9:10 PM:

" Mr. Feasor I agree 100% Pretty serious stuff to be sure! Back at you on the thanks! I really hope we have all learned from this current forum on the seriousness of this subject. No one can make this decision for you or me or anyone else. When it all comes down to it, we all have to make the decision that is right for us at the time the decision needs to be made, and we will all have to stand alone with the consequences our decision! "

reason-ator wrote on Jan 7, 2009 9:59 PM:

" My dogs will eat the evidence "

jefferson wrote on Jan 10, 2009 6:48 AM:

" PROWLER - Be informed that the Neighborhood Watch has been alerted.

ALL neighbors eyes and ears are vigilantly on the lookout and will "intervene" immediately! "

smartypants wrote on Jan 11, 2009 9:30 AM:

" Get a dog not a gun! Our dogs "Big" bark has kept many people from coming up to our house (if they only knew she would just lick them to death, ha,ha) and it helps keep the solicitors away as well. We have not had one incident with thieves since we got our pup. That is not the case before hand.
You could save 2 lives by adopting from a shelter or rescue group(yours and your new best friends).

My 3 cents! "

anticommie wrote on Jan 11, 2009 12:10 PM:

" smartypants:

I agree about the dog, but get a gun too. "

Epeescott wrote on Jan 12, 2009 8:53 AM:

" DB76: I carry my gun in my home when I'm awake because I don't want to put it down around my children, and I still want ease of access to it. Otherwise, I have quick release locks installed in my home for various guns in various rooms. I carry my gun when I'm out of my home because the Second Amendment says it is lawful to do so, and I consider it like a fire extinguisher - you buy them, but hope you never have to use them, but when you DO need to use them you are glad you have them.

I just looked at the Napa interactive map showing all the crime by month here on this site - very interesting. I have a security system and I am glad I do - one more reason to be able to articulate fear for my life, if a shrill alarm is going off and someone is STILL in my home.

And the last comment I have for you is: what a shame that our society so fears inanimate tools made of metal and wood, that someone who says they carry one is automatically assumed by the liberal socialists to be mentally unwell. Fact is, the majority of gun culture people are well adjusted, fiscally responsible, all around good people. Your typical stereotyping of gun people as white sheet wearers or beer drinking militia members is utterly false. "

anticommie wrote on Jan 12, 2009 2:14 PM:

" Epeescott:

Couldnt say it better myself! "

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