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Who won the town hall Presidential debate?
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CommentMcCain and Obama squared off in a town hall style debate Tuesday night, who had the upper hand?
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Dwayne wrote on Oct 7, 2008 6:33 PM:
Is that all we have to offer...???...!!! "
common sense wrote on Oct 7, 2008 6:50 PM:
kevin wrote on Oct 7, 2008 7:21 PM:
bloodagar wrote on Oct 7, 2008 7:24 PM:
Barak Obama...I wish he'd answer questions without Iraq rhetoric or address social security "hopefully within my first term"
Wow...I think John McCain should be the next president...I don't think I am on the fence anymore. "
another voice wrote on Oct 7, 2008 7:30 PM:
napawinelady wrote on Oct 7, 2008 7:41 PM:
hothedz wrote on Oct 7, 2008 7:43 PM:
hothedz wrote on Oct 7, 2008 7:45 PM:
hothedz wrote on Oct 7, 2008 7:48 PM:
to understand the issues!!! "
Hear Ye wrote on Oct 7, 2008 7:48 PM:
SouthNapa wrote on Oct 7, 2008 7:49 PM:
comment wrote on Oct 7, 2008 7:51 PM:
Kevin, McCain himself was mentioning global warming and acknowledged that it was a man made cause. "
drtymick75 wrote on Oct 7, 2008 7:56 PM:
Designer Napkin wrote on Oct 7, 2008 8:03 PM:
Hear Ye wrote on Oct 7, 2008 8:09 PM:
CNN/opinion research
Obama- 51
McCain- 39 "
TrickleDown wrote on Oct 7, 2008 8:24 PM:
Ha ha...the debate was just half over and the republicans knew who won. Looks like they don't listen to all of the words. Oh yeah, the quoted opinion is exactly opposite that of the Ohio undecideds and independents that were polled throughout and after. I guess it pays to actually listen to words than spout partisan nonsense. "
a teacher wrote on Oct 7, 2008 8:26 PM:
McCain's mortgage plan smacks of desperation. A good idea, but not exactly new. "
suze wrote on Oct 7, 2008 8:31 PM:
antipc wrote on Oct 7, 2008 8:34 PM:
Unfortunately the mainstream media makes you feel good about you delusions.
The only looser in this debate was America, because both voted for the bailout. A pork ridin' scheme that our children will be paying for.
The winner decides how much our children's souls will end up in servitude. "
NapaConservative wrote on Oct 7, 2008 8:40 PM:
MarkMiwords wrote on Oct 7, 2008 8:46 PM:
Hear Ye wrote on Oct 7, 2008 8:48 PM:
Obama-54
+\- 4
McCain-30
even better than I thought "
musikluvr wrote on Oct 7, 2008 8:53 PM:
The gentleman could have dragged every bid of hateful dirt out against Obama but he is too good a man to stoop that low.
If you are so shallow as to need a person to mesmerize you with his oratory maybe Adolph Hitler is your man.
Unions and teachers and government workers and every other pig at the trough will vote for Obama because they need the government to support them - how sad. "
B-Side wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:00 PM:
Ruff Limblog wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:00 PM:
Napa's self-styled conservatives are soon to be heartbroken.
~Ruff "
noblindershere wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:02 PM:
Raven wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:03 PM:
common sense wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:04 PM:
-Actually, McCain won me over for this debate with his comments supporting nuclear power. Guess you should try getting all the information first before making assumptions with your preconceived notions. "
comment wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:09 PM:
Hear Ye wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:09 PM:
Also, it's a DEBATE, oratory skills matter! By your logic McCain won before it even started. "
Hopingforchange wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:14 PM:
This debate was clearly won by Obama. "
Hopingforchange wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:19 PM:
Not even close! A new approach to this problem is long over due and so is a good man in the white house. GO OBAMA!!! "
noblindershere wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:22 PM:
I have yet to read anything con/lib that stats McCain won. Hands down Obama is the winner in refernce to the economy. "
zanchin wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:24 PM:
Bauhausfan wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:26 PM:
Hilarious. "
whodidit wrote on Oct 7, 2008 9:57 PM:
bettye wrote on Oct 7, 2008 10:00 PM:
abouttime wrote on Oct 7, 2008 10:05 PM:
irishrover94503 wrote on Oct 7, 2008 10:18 PM:
MyWrites wrote on Oct 7, 2008 11:47 PM:
McCain's refusal to even look at Obama during the debate and refer to him as "that one..." does not sit well with many people, It doesn't convey the polish and graciousness that a presidential contender should exhibit. Even Republicans are embarrassed by McCain's senatorial affections for Joe Lieberman (mentioned 3 times by my count).
I think Obama was a clear winner of this debate. He connects better with people and he answered the questions that were asked.
antipc wrote:
"All you leftists think Obama won because he didn't lose by an overwhelming majority. Unfortunately the mainstream media makes you feel good about you delusions."
Apparently you weren't watching FOX News! Their highly "scientific" phone-in-your vote showed McCain (88%) and Obama (12%). Now there's objectivity that even you can relate to! "
asahigo wrote on Oct 8, 2008 3:11 AM:
cop105 wrote on Oct 8, 2008 7:09 AM:
tfytmp wrote on Oct 8, 2008 7:29 AM:
doscentavos wrote on Oct 8, 2008 7:44 AM:
McCain insisted on continuing the personal jabs on Sen. Obama, who has taken the high road and responded with correct info.
This Independent voter is voting for Obama. "
Sandra wrote on Oct 8, 2008 7:50 AM:
Now as to what I saw in this debate....Obama said alot of what McCain said, after McCain said it first. I found that very interesting. But over all, I was not too impressed by either man. Maybe it was the questions asked? There were hardly any decent questions put forth. Only a couple of new points brought forth...and a pretty ho hum debate over all. "
Ruff Limblog wrote on Oct 8, 2008 7:50 AM:
John McCain is losing, and Sarah Palin is his boat anchor.
Local Republicans are about to enter the grieving process... they've taken in Republican KoolAide for decades now and they actually thought that Republicans actually stood for 'Small Government', 'Fiscal Responsibility', 'Family Values' and other admirable principles when actually Republican politicians really only stood for the lobbyist money they could grub up.
Our local folks who fell for skillful 'opinion mercenaries' actually thought that the rest of the American family were immoral degenerates who are 'commies', 'traitors', and 'Hated America'.
Shouts from Republican audiences like 'Traitor', and 'Kill Him!' are a sure sign that the strategy of going massively negative is flop.
Real patriotic Americans understand that electioneering speeches should stop short of ginning up mobs with people calling for politically-based murder.
Decent Republicans are going to rebuke the demons of hate, I am sure. I'd like to encourage them to do that right here and right now.
So let's give them a chance to show us what decent Republicans stand for as they reject this hate-mongering.
Politics is an argument about how to best run our country, but it's an argument within our American family and now it's time to offer Republicans the chance to be graceful, principled losers this time around.
The 2010 and 2012 election cycles start on November 5th, 2008. And we will ALL need to watch Washington, DC like a hawk.
~Ruff "
SFpop wrote on Oct 8, 2008 8:14 AM:
My favorite part last night, was when McCain referred to Obama as "THAT ONE". McCain made himself look like a back end of a beast of burden. I have to admit, I laughed a lot.
Obama showed more strength last night. True, he sort of talked like he was running for Class President instead of the US President, but I gotta say, I feel safer with Obama in the office than McCain.
Obama did last night what most of us leftists have been waiting for... he called McCain out on his lies. I can't wait for the 3rd debate to see how high Obama will rise and how low McCain will sink. "
C'mon reg get it right wrote on Oct 8, 2008 8:21 AM:
I actually respect John McCain for not bring up the dirt that Palin brought up. He's being honorable there. Knows there nothing there and it would probably hurt him more anyway. "
srnitnw wrote on Oct 8, 2008 8:33 AM:
" I had to watch a particular part three times(DVR) to try to understand what McCain said in refernce to the, "$700 billion bailout will be going to terrorist"
He was referring to the money spent on foreign oil - not the bailout. "
grape wrote on Oct 8, 2008 8:59 AM:
McCain showed passion for what he wants to do, that's what I saw. Obama only looks like he won because he sits there with his nose up in the air acting all cool and cocky...that doesn't mean he's right for the job, just means people are fooled by appearances.
I'm voting McCain. "
anewcommenter wrote on Oct 8, 2008 9:11 AM:
luv1mom wrote on Oct 8, 2008 9:34 AM:
reason-ator wrote on Oct 8, 2008 9:40 AM:
"My candidate won because I decided ahead of time that he would." "
napabiker wrote on Oct 8, 2008 9:54 AM:
The responses are utterly predictable and useless. McCain supporters are going to think their guy won and Obama supporters theirs. "
John Richards wrote on Oct 8, 2008 10:07 AM:
Some of his speech habits are getting annoying, like his drawn out and overemphasized "AND" that he uses to connect points of his argument together. "
MyWrites wrote on Oct 8, 2008 10:22 AM:
I really wish cable news would actually attempt some objective polling from a neutral outside source. Closest I've seen is CNN with Obama (60%) and McCain (40%). It's probably much closer with the majority to Obama. Point is we don't even need another debate; most have already made up their minds for one candidate or the other. Most people will vote the candidate of their chosen party, good or bad. Changing sides is never easy like changing churches - most won't. Some will vote "none of the above" (sit this one out), though I suspect the majority of those will be Republicans embarrassed by this administration's terrible record.
McCain has consistently catered to the old guard and that will lose him the election. Surge aside, this Iraq war has become our Achilles heel. Economically it has killed us along with the other domestic terrorists on Wall Street (don't we have plenty of extra space at Gitmo for some of these guys?).
All the declarations of being a "maverick" are laughable when one examines McCain's record; it's just not there. The younger vote will put Obama over the top. The younger people will call for an end to the Iraq war. McCain's declaration of "victory" there is about as hollow as Nixon's was in Vietnam.
What everyone MUST insist upon is a completely honest election with easily accessed and verifiable results. We do not have time to squander on some protracted final determination like in 2000. "
NVR-Dan Ross wrote on Oct 8, 2008 10:30 AM:
Take a look and you'll see editorials from the Register each of the last six weeks on the issues and the stances on those issues from each of the candidates. I believe that's exactly what you are looking for. Just go to the Elections tab on the homepage. "
NapaCA wrote on Oct 8, 2008 10:42 AM:
From an economic standpoint, neither is qualified to lead - - there is absolutely no business experience between them - - neither has run a business, made payroll, competed in the private sector let alone a global economy.
Furthermore, their performance on the national stage is embarrassing - - trading barbs and insults like adolescents. When did a smug look of contempt while your opponent is speaking become considered 'presidential'? "
amigo wrote on Oct 8, 2008 10:44 AM:
Build the superhighway "
voter wrote on Oct 8, 2008 10:46 AM:
voter wrote on Oct 8, 2008 10:51 AM:
rage against wrote on Oct 8, 2008 10:57 AM:
Although I agree with most of what you are saying, I don't think I can let the Republicans go gracefully. Not that I harbor any serious animosity towards them, I just have real problems with their judgment.
In particular, their blind, undying, and mostly indirect support of war and forced occupation. Seperating their fearful bloodlust from their obvious lack of critical thinking and logic is dificult, but over the years I have managed to pry the two apart. What I am left with is a basic survival reaction, and an absolutely crippled abilty to critically assess reality.
Our basic survival instincts will always be easily manipulated by the apeal to fear fallacy. All people are vulnerable to this manipulation, so I can let the Republicans and everyone (including myself) off the hook for that one. The complete lack of and ignorance towards logical thinking that exists in America, particularly right-wing America, should not recieve a pass.
We are all guilty of this, the Republicans relatively more so than the rest, but none of us should be gracefully allowed to continue along this flawed path. We need to put an end to armed conflict, an end to pollution, an end to a government and economy bent on greed, manipulation, and oppression.
A vote for Obama is a step in the right direction, but I hope we all have the ability and courage to ask ourselves if we are even on the right road. "
bettye wrote on Oct 8, 2008 10:57 AM:
flacoman wrote on Oct 8, 2008 11:39 AM:
Thinking back to when Mccain called Obama an "elitest" and then seeing Cindy Mccains body language around the crowd was jarring. Here were the Obamas, posing for photo-ops, both at least seeming to enjoy themselves, and Cindy Mccain looking like she had just stepped in something. Talk about an elitest. "
mytwocents wrote on Oct 8, 2008 12:09 PM:
misfit wrote on Oct 8, 2008 12:09 PM:
And, I just want to add, that all of you pro-birthers would just as soon abandon that child once they are born. Would you deny healthcare to children in this country simply because their parents could not afford it? Some pro-lifers you are.
Thank God there are still some humanitarians among us. "
steph wrote on Oct 8, 2008 12:15 PM:
Why I myself practically swooned when he said he wanted to improve government efficiencies and get rid of programs that don't work. SWOONED!
He almost has me convinced he's a moderate. "
Leah wrote on Oct 8, 2008 12:30 PM:
freeport56 wrote on Oct 8, 2008 12:31 PM:
Coulkd the economist or math guru expalin this to me?
I am stunned that so many think Obama won. Every program he talked about will cost the tax payer. Taxing those companys that provide jobs will not create more jobs. BHO's healthcare plan will cost $65 Billion a year of tax payer dollars.
I just do not get you guys. "
happyday wrote on Oct 8, 2008 12:39 PM:
Barack Obama kept his composure, and looked presidential.
It looked like a tie, and things appear unchanged. "
reader wrote on Oct 8, 2008 1:00 PM:
Democrats want the best for all Americans.
OBAMA '08! "
FerrariGTC wrote on Oct 8, 2008 1:29 PM:
dellasumbrella wrote on Oct 8, 2008 1:40 PM:
John Richards -- Yeah, my father used to do that drawn out "and..." as well. The reason? He did it when he had a lot of knowledge about the subject and (1) was sorting through the facts to decide which might be the most pertinent to the question or situation, and (2) was trying to phrase it in a way people could understand. He was sometimes teased for his deliberate approach to communication, yet I really appreciated his dedication to truth and conveying that truth so others would get it. He had his own business, so it was important that his employees understood the whats and whys. He was also a university instructor, so it was important students could understand the complex physics concepts he was teaching.
Much as it causes me to hold my breath sometimes when Obama hesitates, I am almost never disappointed with the results. He's demonstrating "thinking on his feet" as opposed to blurting out memorized slogans or automatic platitudes. I'll try to take Ruff's advice to lighten up on Republicans by not saying who I see doing the slogans & platitudes most in this election. I will say that it seemed McCain tried to present a fresh idea in talking about helping people with their mortgages. I don't think his "base" liked it much, though. "
Hear Ye wrote on Oct 8, 2008 1:53 PM:
I'll take polls over people who post who won half way into the debate or people who say actual debate performance has no bearing on who won the debate. Huh? "
citizen wrote on Oct 8, 2008 2:08 PM:
McCain's health care fix will require new taxes on your $5,000 share. That will not only raises your taxes, it creates a brand new tax.
McCain's getting alot of criticism from the republicans for that one. Not good for him. "
citizen wrote on Oct 8, 2008 2:11 PM:
"That one" won the debate. So happy McCain sees Obama as "The One."
Thanks John McSame for the Obama vote! "
reader wrote on Oct 8, 2008 2:54 PM:
As one republican I know put it "The good heart of the conservative base is missing and threatened with extinction, with Palin on the ticket, and this breaks my heart."
"rage against" missed your point, I think. "
Raven wrote on Oct 8, 2008 3:04 PM:
the national debt that year was 5.6 trillion..... "
Kevin Eggers wrote on Oct 8, 2008 3:55 PM:
Sure, Obama and McCain have their differences, but not where it really matters. These debates are entertainment for Americans that still haven't figured out that the same money has purchased both sides.
As Pat Buchanan said, "the Republican and Democratic Parties are wings on the same bird of prey."
Connie Fogal, head of the Canadian Action Party, at the Project Censored Lecture at Sonoma State University, spoke about how people have to “think, think, think” about what they’re being told by the government, how the words they use have more than one meaning, and who really benefits.
As my wife and I toured the Napa Valley with Connie, the next day, we talked about what could be done, agreeing that until people recognize the mainstream free press freely reports what the government wants us to hear, and freely protects their own interests, most people will never be able to “think” outside the system. "
GoMommyGo wrote on Oct 8, 2008 4:08 PM:
Magoo wrote on Oct 8, 2008 5:29 PM:
The fact that people even have to debate who won last nights debate tells you who won, Obama did!!
Mr. McCain asked to have 3 debates in this "townhall" format because it is his strength, his most comfortable style, and he failed. "
Grommitt wrote on Oct 8, 2008 5:34 PM:
14obama wrote on Oct 8, 2008 5:43 PM:
asahigo wrote on Oct 8, 2008 6:44 PM:
" What are you all talking about? McCain "SNUBBED" Obama? He was childish? Did you watch it to the end? McCain HUGGED the man. He shook hands with Obama and then HUGGED Obama.
LOL ok I must've switched channels before that happened. Once the last question was answered I left because the mediator has a very annoying voice "
Sandra wrote on Oct 8, 2008 7:04 PM:
Small Businesses are the major job providers in most economies. The top job provider is those with less than 10 employees, and those with 10 or more but less than 20 employees comes in as the second, and those with 20 or more but less than 50 employees comes in as the third.
Let's think about this...10 employees...let's say they are paid $8.00 per hour, 40 hour week. That is an output of $12,800 a week, not counting taxes paid by the employer. That is $153, 600, a year in wages alone, lets estimate the taxes at $300. per month per employee. That equals $36,000 per year. Add together it equals $189,600 per year in employee expenses. I am being very conservative with these figures. I am not even addressing health insurance either. Now let's think about operating expenses...Utilities, rent, accounting, supplies, gas....Do you think that is under $11,000 dollars for the year?
And do you think most people only make $8.00 per hour?
How would any business survive only making $200,000 dollars per year????
His figures must be coming from planet "let's pretend".
Small businesses will be hit by his Tax raises. I would be worried if I had a small business that had employees...They may all be out of jobs if Obama's tax plan gets adopted.
I have a small business with only myself employed, thank goodness....But I think of small business owners I know that would be hurt by his tax proposal and, and it is a whole lot of people. "
Hear Ye wrote on Oct 8, 2008 7:27 PM:
McCain misstated his own health care plan, saying he’d give a $5,000 tax credit to “every American” His plan actually would provide only $2,500 per individual, or $5,000 for couples and families. He also misstated Obama’s health care plan, claiming it would levy fines on “small businesses” that fail to provide health insurance. Actually, Obama’s plan exempts “small businesses.” "
tfytmp wrote on Oct 8, 2008 7:28 PM:
14obama wrote on Oct 8, 2008 7:48 PM:
When Palin made a bunch of noise about her son in Iraq and how he's fighting for our freedom,I say she's on the same wavelength as Bush.
Must I say it again ? "WE do not belong in Iraq" !! We weren't attacked by Iraq ! It's all; about OIL ! Get it through your pea brained heads ! Our military has been hoodwinked by rats ! Bring em home !!! "
rogers wrote on Oct 8, 2008 7:57 PM:
In 2000 alone, 94% of all U.S. corporations paid less than 5% of their total income in corporate taxes, the GAO reported.
Frankly I hope the next president goes after the corporations that do not pay their fair share. Corporations are also footing less of the total tax bill. In 2003, corporate taxes were 7.4% of overall receipts, the lowest level since 1983. Individual taxpayers forked up 45%, with the rest coming from employment and excise taxes.
The maximum corporate tax rate is 35% but rarely seen. "
Sandra wrote on Oct 8, 2008 8:06 PM:
tfytmp...How do you know that?....Go get a business liscense...they ask what do you make?...meaning gross income, and you pay your license fee based on that gross income. Fill out your tax form....what goes at the top...gross income...you get your deductions etc, and are taxed accordingly....but Obama has never said income after expenses...so how do you know that? He said most small businesses make under $200,000 dollars.... He has never said after expenses.
If that is what he means, why wouldn't he say that? "
rogers wrote on Oct 8, 2008 8:20 PM:
Sandra do you honestly think he will do anything to change the tax code that is driving this country into debt. Only the middle class of this country is overburdened. He has already stated we need to give greater tax breaks to the nation's corporations. What garbage!
Your president and treasury secretary could come up with nothing better than have the government bail out Wall Street. Republicans are incapable of changing this paradigm.
McCain is McSame. He's NOT a Maverick - he's a Republican and that's where his head is - someplace where the sun don't shine! "
a teacher wrote on Oct 8, 2008 9:12 PM:
I know how much you like factcheck, Sandra... "
dellasumbrella wrote on Oct 8, 2008 9:17 PM:
Duck wrote on Oct 8, 2008 11:03 PM:
OBAMA - OBAMA- OBAMA ! "
vocal-de-local wrote on Oct 8, 2008 11:15 PM:
Obama certainly has a warm personality. If I had to be stuck in a room with either one of these guys, I would choose Obama, and the rest of the world probably feels the same way. I want us to win back world respect. Obama seems much more diplomatic. I believe our country will be safer with him in office.
However, neither one of the candidates was willing to talk about how the American people are going to have to step up to the plate. We are in a mess. We are going to have to raise taxes, no doubt about it. I know. It's not fair but that's where we're headed, like it or not. When I hear the same old same rhetoric about cutting taxes, I know they are both full of B-S. Sure, we can tax the rich. But some of that money must go toward reducing debt. I want a president who is a realist and will level with us.
And the heallthcare plan: Can we really afford to pay for this right now? At the very least we need to talk about personal responsibility. Medical care should never be 100% free. We need a reasonably high deductible, catastrophic type healthcare plan which will encourage people to take better care of themselves.
We cannot have our cake and eat it too. We've already eaten the cake and really, all we have left are a bunch of crumbs. Let's also quit pretending as though we can afford to be world peacemakers when it's so costly. We need to focus on ourselves for awhile.
Oh...Obama won, no doubt about it. "
Sandra wrote on Oct 9, 2008 8:42 AM:
Hopefully your past "estimates" have been correct, or you could be in some trouble.
Teacher, I thought after meeting me that you would be able to control your snideness. You were doing fine until your last sentence...I was nice to you, wasn't I? Are you mad cause I didn't eat your soup? I had just eaten before coming and truly was not hungry. I do like fact check...I will go check it out. ;p "
rage against wrote on Oct 9, 2008 8:59 AM:
I was trying to point out that Republicans and Democrats suffer from the same desease. We have almost completely lost our ability to critically analyze the situations that surround ourselves and our country.
Proof can be seen in the right wing Republican base which can be so easily whipped up into a violence-supporting fervor with little to no objection. In front of these people you could turn gumbee into Adolph Hitler with the right talking points.
With these extreme Republicans as the obvious core of the problem, it shows us just how deep the fissure is. The Democrats, though not as obvious, will trust their shephards with just as much blind faith. It seems at times that talking points, and pictures have become more important than what we actually percieve in our daily reality.
I really think Democrat or Republican, we are taking a bite of the same sandwich, walking down the same road. Yes, Obama will be a better president than John McCain, but both of these candidates support war and forced occupation of some kind.
In much the same way giant, corporate conglomerates can get your money no matter which product you buy (because they own most of the procuders), the candidates are being funded by mostly the same people.
This is not to say I have lost all faith in our country, or our humanity. I think it might be time to break out of the two-party mold, and critically assess all of our options.
And, We shouldn't allow, or let up on a mentality which for the past eight years has supported death, greed, and ignorance. "
reader wrote on Oct 9, 2008 9:55 AM:
msdemo wrote on Oct 9, 2008 1:15 PM:
I want a person who is thoughtful before speaking, gets the facts and weighs them before making a decision. I want someone who is smarter than me! I do not want Joe or Joan 6 pak.
I was very impressed with Obama's demeanor during the debate. McCain again disappointed me. We have a Joe 6 pak in office now. TIME for a change! "
dellasumbrella wrote on Oct 9, 2008 1:28 PM:
I also misstated the federal tax thing -- it's actually not "net" income, but "profit" on business, after expenses that I was talking about. So here's the question: Give or take a few loopholes & payouts I guess to investors or whatever other deductions there may be on business profits, is the tax Obama's talking about on those profits, or on the gross income of the business owner? Two separate things. I'm babbling. I'll have to look that up. "
Sandra wrote on Oct 9, 2008 6:29 PM:
It does make a difference. "
MarkMiwords wrote on Oct 9, 2008 9:22 PM:
After a storm, flood, or stampede, the ranchers would have to sort out the inter-mingled herds. Maverick claimed all of the unbranded cattle, knowing that some of them were his neighbor's, but too young to brand, or just newly acquired. Tom Maverick's name came to be associated with someone who didn't follow the rules, but it wasn't in a good connotation. It was because he took advantage of other's ill-fortunes. Ironic, isn't it?!! "
ADark1 wrote on Oct 10, 2008 9:23 AM:
Aside from tens of thousands of voters already being twisted in a circular manner ( wouldn't let me use the S word) So their votes wont count, its not enough. The time for hate and fear, ruling the day, is coming to an end! "
msdemo wrote on Oct 10, 2008 10:20 AM:
rage against wrote on Oct 10, 2008 10:55 AM:
I don't think you understood my point, that the crazy fringe idiots are just the tip of the iceberg. There existence and increasing numbers point to a dreary conclusion about our country.
I stated very clearly that the Democrats were behaving just as the Republicans, just that there recent actions were not as obviously crazy as the Republicans.
I also attempted to state that I don't really trust the "good, solid base" of either party, but you don't seem to be getting those points.
As I agree with Ruff and most logical people that the Republicans are on the losing end of the "who is less crazy" battle, I disagree that we should let them gracefully lose. They are not gracefully losing. In fact nothing about this entire campaign, on either side, has been very graceful.
So, no free pass from me this time. I will continue to call foul when I see it, and I won't reconcile with people that are dangerous and stupid. "
misfit wrote on Oct 11, 2008 6:00 PM:
John Richards wrote on Oct 11, 2008 6:11 PM:
You an I may differ over the legality and need for starting the Iraq war, but the plain fact is that we are deeply engaged in that war, and we can't just have our troops come home. It would result in the largest sectarian bloodbath this world has ever seen, followed by Iraq being carved up between Iran and Turkey. Is that what you really want? "
dONTwORRy wrote on Oct 14, 2008 7:18 PM:
Think About it??? Think Of Not Just Yourself ( pretty Much Stop Being Selfish) But Others. We're in this together. So Lets go whats Right??? "
anticommie wrote on Oct 19, 2008 4:50 PM:
"Think Of Not Just Yourself ( pretty Much Stop Being Selfish) But Others. We're in this together. So Lets go whats Right??? "
Its my God given American right to be selfish if I want, and the government shouldnt TAKE from me, just because it's "Fair." Life isnt fair. Some people become CEO's, some teachers, others gang members, drug users. Why should I be forced to PAY for THEIR choices? make 'em fend for themselves like the rest of us. I dont want my neighbors help, i dont need it, thanks but no thanks. I'm not my neighbors reponsibility. "